Thanks for visiting from LinkedIn. Most sites, including this one, may not display properly inside the LinkedIn app. For the best experience, tap the three dots in the top right corner of your screen and choose “Open in Browser.” ~ Jason | Big World Made Small

Episode #162: Charlie Krarup

Managing Director

Adventure Base – Experts in the Alps

Episode #162: Charlie Krarup
Video Episode
No Ad Breaks
Play Clip
Full Episode
Download Short Video Clip to Share Download Cover Art to Share

Follow, Rate, or Provide a Testimonial

Guest Bio

Charlie Krarup is the Owner and Managing Director of Adventure Base, a leading adventure travel company specializing in experiences across the European Alps. With a deep passion for mountain sports and a knack for big-picture thinking, Charlie leads a dedicated team that designs unforgettable alpine adventures—from mountaineering and trekking to ski touring and trail running.

A lifelong outdoor enthusiast, Charlie brings an energetic, hands-on approach to leadership, blending strategic vision with a love for challenge and exploration. As both founder and operator, he’s grown Adventure Base into a trusted partner for guided and self-guided experiences, known for its personalized service, meticulous planning, and commitment to safety. Whether working with solo travelers or custom group tours, Charlie and his team aim to make every journey seamless, inspiring, and deeply memorable.

Show Summary

In this episode of the Big World Made Small Adventure Travel Podcast, host Jason Elkins speaks with Charlie about his journey from a corporate career to becoming the owner of one of the Alps’ most respected adventure travel companies. He shares how a pivotal moment—and his wife’s encouragement—sparked his transition into building a business around his love for the outdoors.

The conversation explores the unique appeal of the European Alps, where Adventure Base offers a wide range of year-round activities for all skill levels. Charlie dives into the philosophy behind the company’s trips, the importance of language in adventure marketing, and how client expectations shape each experience. He also opens up about working alongside his wife, navigating cultural differences across alpine regions, and the values that drive his team’s success—chief among them: authenticity, communication, and meaningful connections with clients.

Key Takeaways

  • ✓ Adventure travel is defined by a strong physical component.
  • ✓ Adventure Base offers both high-intensity and more accessible “soft” adventure trips.
  • ✓ Language plays a pivotal role in how adventure experiences are marketed and received.
  • ✓ The Alps offer much more than skiing, with activities available throughout all seasons.
  • ✓ Understanding and anticipating client needs is central to designing the right experience.
  • ✓ The right business partner can make or break your entrepreneurial journey.
  • ✓ Shared adventures create deeper, more lasting memories.
  • ✓ Cultural nuances across countries in the Alps require thoughtful trip planning.
  • ✓ Working with your spouse requires intentional communication and clear boundaries.
  • ✓ Building trust with clients is more effective than traditional sales tactics.

What You’ll Find on Adventure Base

  • ✓ Guided and self-guided mountaineering, trekking, trail running, and ski touring trips
  • ✓ Custom itineraries tailored to group goals and experience levels
  • ✓ Pre-trip briefings, logistics planning, and GPX route support
  • ✓ A passionate team of experienced guides and support staff
  • ✓ A client-first approach for both B2C and B2B adventure travelers
  • ✓ A mission to protect and celebrate the natural beauty of the Alps

Learn more about Adventure Base – Experts in the Alps and connect with Charlie at:

https://www.adventurebase.com

Big World Made Small guest features are invitation-only and selected based on story, experience, and fit with the show. Guest support helps make the episode possible, but it does not determine who is featured. This helps keep the show free of third-party ads and interruptions while keeping the focus on real, story-driven conversations.

Guest access: enter your password to unlock your resources.

Guest & Partner Resources (Private)

Thank you Charlie, for being a Base Camp Partner with us.

We’d love to have you join us at the next level and get even more out of your appearance on the Big World Made Small Podcast.

Below you will find access to tools to help you promote your episode and get the most from your partnership benefits. This section is only visible when you use the link we sent, or by entering the password BWMS8873. Do not share the email we sent, or the password, unless you want the person to access the following resources.

Follow, Rate, or Provide a Testimonial

Please use this tracking link to share with your audience:
https://bigworldmadesmall.com/guest/charlie-krarup/?ref=guest8873

Cover Art

This is available to all podcast guests.

Episode #162: Charlie Krarup
Video Episode
No Ad Breaks
Play Clip
Full Episode

Download the file to use on your website or social media posts.

Download Short Video Clip to Share Download Cover Art to Share

Buzzsprout Audio Player

This is available to all podcast guests.

This is the best option for website embeds, especially prior to the release date. Guests can listen to your episode on your website. This player keeps listeners on your site, which is why I use it.

Use this code to embed your Buzzsprout Player directly on your website:

<div id="buzzsprout-player-18579256"></div><script src="https://www.buzzsprout.com/2216718/episodes/18579256-adventure-travel-with-charlie-krarup-adventure-base-experts-in-the-alps.js?container_id=buzzsprout-player-18579256&player=small" type="text/javascript" charset="utf-8"></script>

Full-Length YouTube Video Player

This is available to Base Camp, Expedition, and Summit Partners.

You can share it before the release date, but your video won’t be searchable on YouTube until the release date. The player allows site visitors to watch your episode directly on your site.

Use this code to embed your YouTube Video directly on your website:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/21kXnlQrlqM?rel=0" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" referrerpolicy="strict-origin-when-cross-origin" allowfullscreen></iframe>

45 Minute One-on-One Website Review

This is available to Base Camp, Expedition, and Summit Partners.

Your package includes a 45 minute video call where I will be your second set of eyeballs as we go through your website looking for a handful of changes or updates you can make to improve your conversions. I will share my feedback and you can share it with your marketing team, or we can explore ways that I may be able to help you make the changes. This is not a sales call, it’s an idea session that will give you some actionable insights and you can decide how to implement them.

Big World Made Small Podcast Pitch Portal©

This is available to Expedition & Summit Partners.

Upgrade to unlock these benefits.

All Video & Audio Files with Rights to Repurpose

This is available to Expedition and Summit Partners.

Upgrade to unlock these benefits.

45 Minute Content Strategy Session

This is available to Expedition and Summit Partners.

Upgrade to unlock these benefits.

Custom Branded Video Clips (12 clips)

This is available to Summit Partners.

Upgrade to unlock these benefits.

2 x 45 Minute Digital Marketing Strategy Sessions

This is available to Summit Partners.

Upgrade to unlock these benefits.

Review & Suggest Topic Tags

Review Episode Topics

Suggestions only

These topic suggestions help keep this episode profile accurate and easier to find. Your suggestions will be reviewed before any changes are made.

Select up to 8 topic tags.
Suggested new topics will not be added automatically. They will be reviewed first.

Podcast Transcript

This transcript is auto-generated on recording, and has not been edited by a human. It may contain lots of mistakes, crazy words, and stuff that makes no sense. The host and the guest are not responsible for the accuracy of the transcript.

Jason Elkins (00:01.389)
Welcome back everybody to another episode of the Big World Made Small podcast for the Adventure Traveler. So happy to have each and every one of you back today. Also super excited to have my guest today. We’ve got Charlie Krarup. See Charlie, knew I I practiced it 10 times. I think I got it though, Krarup, Managing Director of Adventure Base Experts in the Alps. Charlie, how are you? Good to see you.

Charlie (00:15.662)
Thank

That counts.

Charlie (00:24.406)
Yeah, I’m very well, thanks. said you knew that would happen, didn’t you?

Jason Elkins (00:28.453)
I did, and that’s why I wanted to practice and then it’s still kind of stumbled over. It’s not the first time and it’s kind of embarrassing for a podcast. I’ve got 160 episodes in, I’ve probably have stumbled on 150 names even when it’s Smith or Jones or whatever. So Charlie, thanks for your patience. You want to say it right for the audience so they can make sure they hear it right at least once?

Charlie (00:30.894)
Thanks.

Charlie (00:44.803)
Yeah.

Charlie (00:48.878)
Well, it’s Charlie Krarup but I wouldn’t worry about it. I’ve had much worse. And yeah, you did a pretty good job of it. So Charlie Krarup

Jason Elkins (00:54.149)
Super excited to have you here. You’ve got a fascinating story. We’ve spoke before and I thought we just needed to come back and record it. But before we get into your story, because I want to figure out how you got from where you were to where you are now. But before we do that, let’s give everybody, our listeners kind of an idea of what is adventure based. I mentioned experts in the Alps. So obviously it’s tied to the Alps.

So give us the 30 60 second elevator pitch. can go longer, but I just want listeners to get an opportunity to hear what you do before we go discuss why you do it.

Charlie (01:29.462)
Yeah, thanks Jason. So, yes, we’re Adventure Base and we focus on adventure travel holidays in the Alps. So that’s mountaineering, trekking, ski touring, and now trail running trips across the whole of the Alps. We do it for a number of different audiences, a B2C audience, a B2B audience. We do lots of the common trips like climbing Mont Blanc or Tour de Mont Blanc trek.

or the Alta Via one track and we do some bespoke custom trips where people want to what we call the hidden out, try something a little different and a little quieter. We have an office in Chamonix in France, which is a nice place to have an office. We have an office in the UK and we have a team member working in Canada as well for our US Canadian audience. And the company has a checkered history. There’s two versions. There’s the 2008

founding of the company and then there’s the 2020 rebirth of the company. So I’m sure we’ll get onto that in due course. But yeah, that’s who we are. We’re adventure-based, we’re experts in the apps and we help you adventure like a local.

Jason Elkins (02:42.713)
Very, very cool. I think you, the way you explained it, it’s probably become clear to anybody that’s listening, we’re talking about the European Alps, because I think there’s some people in the world that might argue that, wow, that those aren’t the only Alps in the world, but they’re definitely the ones that spring to mind for me. So we’ve got that clarified. Do you do any of the other Alps in the world? Are we specifically only discussing Alps in Europe?

Charlie (03:08.334)
You’re right. We become a little blinded and by our Alps thinking that they are the best Alps. And of course there are other Alps. But yeah, we are, we’re the European Alps. So the France, the Italy, the Slovenias, Switzerland, Austria and Germany. I’m going to to list them all now. Now I’m going through them, but yeah, we’re those Alps.

Jason Elkins (03:16.119)
You

Jason Elkins (03:32.709)
I’m not gonna put I won’t put you on the spot to list them. I think you got most of them I wouldn’t know if you missed any but I’m curious Do you offer some sort of trip in every country that’s in the Alps?

Charlie (03:45.774)
Yes, uh, depends whether you count Liechtenstein and, and, and Monaco as our countries. They are the, um, uh, but yes, we do. We, the, the, the only part of the, um, Alps or the only country that we’re not fully in, but one of our treks does go in and out is Germany. So Germany has the, Southern Alts in, in, Germany, um, which connect up to the Austrian Alps. Um, and we’re not quite in Germany. There aren’t too many trips or well-known trips that

take place there but in the next couple of years we will be launching a few so at that point we will be in every country in the Alps, European Alps.

Jason Elkins (04:21.765)
Okay, so let’s discuss your definition of the term adventure. So when we talk about adventure travel, it’s a topic that comes up a lot on this show. So for your business, I mean, is this only tracks only mountaineering? Give us kind of an idea of the types of trips, maybe the types of clients that you work with. Just to kind of get our head around that.

Charlie (04:48.332)
Yeah, I mean, it’s a really good question, actually, definition of adventure travel, because it can take on, it’s so different to so many people and there’s lots of different ways of categorizing it. I think for us, there’s a physical element to it. So there’s some sort of journey and certainly the trips that we look to run for our clients, it is the human body physical element. Now, you could argue there’s adventure travel with self-guided…

driving across the Alps, not something we’re planning on doing or want to do at the moment. And you could argue that’s adventure travel, but for us, there’s some sort of physical exertion that takes place. And there’s different levels of adventure. we categorize them into hard and soft. So your hard adventure is what we would consider to be our mountaineering trips. So climbing Mont Blanc or the Matterhorn, our ski touring trips, they’re technical, there’s…

climbing elements to them, the physicality tends to be a little bit higher. And then you have your softer adventures, which tends to be the treks, the trail runs. tends to be not on glaciers. It’s the mid to lower mountain as opposed to the high mountain. And as a company, we started as hard adventure. So we were very focused on the mountaineering, but that’s a really small section of adventure travel. And we’ve,

broadened out into, I guess, more of the mass market, which is the softer adventure. And we as a company are getting softer and softer as we grow. We’re going to launch walking holidays soon. And yeah, and I guess from an audience perspective, it’s very different depending on what you’re looking at. So mountaineering is what we would what we call experience seekers. So it’s I want to climb a mountain. Mont Blanc is a very accessible mountaineering.

mountain, get my picture at the top, then I want to kayak the Norwegian fjords and then I want to do Everest Base Camp and then I want to do Kili. So you kind of have them for a one hit, whereas our trekkers are trekkers and they’re like, well, I want to do lots of treks. I want to do four or five in Europe and then I’ll go over to South America or… So yeah, we have very different audience segments depending on the type of trips that they’re doing. So what is adventure travel? For us,

Charlie (07:14.858)
It is a physical element to a holiday in the out in our case. I don’t know about.

Jason Elkins (07:26.565)
Okay. A couple, a couple of questions that came up there. First is I’m going to name off some things that come to mind when I think of, when I listen to you, I think physical and maybe there’s a, these are big broad categories, you mentioned mountaineering, tracking. Maybe sometimes I might think bicycling, you know,

Jason Elkins (07:49.573)
kayaking, rafting, stuff like that. Do you do all those? Then is there any other category like that you want to mention?

Charlie (07:56.994)
Yeah, no, so we don’t do kayaking. We don’t do cycling, but that is part of the plan in the next few years is to get into the cycling space.

Jason Elkins (08:06.211)
Okay. And the other question, Charlie, I got to ask you is, cause I can see your face. Not everybody’s going to be able to watch the video. They’re just listening to this. But when I heard you say we’re getting softer and softer, there was a look on your face that I want to dig into. Is that hard for someone like you that, you know, you run an adventure travel company and you, I’m presumably we’re to get into your story a little bit here soon, but.

Charlie (08:21.858)
Yeah.

Jason Elkins (08:35.343)
Presumably for you, man like you to say, yeah, we’re getting softer and softer. Is that a difficult thing to say? Do you wish there was a different word that we were using?

Charlie (08:43.182)
No, actually. yeah, okay, I’m drawn to the what the industry terms harder adventure. But, but that is partly dependent on the stage of life I’m in the activities I’ve been interested in. And there is but I still enjoy the softer adventure activities. And no doubt as I get older, I will probably take tackle more softer adventures as my body starts to

Jason Elkins (08:44.75)
you

Charlie (09:12.066)
give up on me, but not really. I’m impartial as to what type of adventure. And you know, the physicality thing is actually, it’s a by-product because it’s the being in the mountains, which is, we think is important in whatever capacity that is. So if I was smiling, there was nothing behind that. You know, I am, whether it’s a soft adventure or hard adventure, I am impartial. I promise you. I do not judge.

Jason Elkins (09:39.813)
I was just curious if we should like, maybe we could create a different word right now, because that’s a, that’s a term in this business. talk about hard adventure, soft adventure, and I’m not sure people that people that are thinking I want to go have an adventure. I’m not sure that they are necessarily going to resonate with the word soft. Like, Oh, for me, it might be an adventure if I’ve never left, um, upstate New York for me to go to Italy and.

Charlie (09:43.639)
Seminole G.

Jason Elkins (10:08.621)
spend a week in the mountains and maybe go paragliding one day. That might be a huge adventure. So I’m not sure from a marketing standpoint that, this is soft adventure. Maybe you and I just need to come up with a new word. I’m not criticizing anything. I’m just saying maybe we need a new word.

Charlie (10:21.326)
No, you’re right. Yeah, and we don’t use it externally. So, I mean, I guess we use it internally too.

Jason Elkins (10:32.281)
Yeah, you wouldn’t put that on. Well, some people put it on their websites. I’ve seen it. I remember when I was kind of cutting my teeth in the business, I worked in the fly fishing travel business and quickly realized that there’s the angler, but then there’s their companion that wants to go along and have a vacation as well. And many of the companies in the fly fishing travel business would, would refer to.

Charlie (10:33.888)
No. Yeah, yeah, that’s interesting. Yeah, I know. Yeah, interesting.

Jason Elkins (11:02.137)
that companion is the non angler. we have activities for non anglers. And I had a very good mentor that said, nobody wants to be a non anything. Right? So we were not, we’re never going to use the word non angler, non non participant, non climber, non drekker. We’re going to just figure out some different word to do that. So anyway, those kind of went off on a, on a tangent.

Charlie (11:25.462)
No, but I mean, no, I agree with you. The whole marketing piece and the language is very important. You’ve got to be. It’s amazing. So one of the things we’ve recently done is we, I’m sure every travel adventure tour operator says the same things. There are certain trips which have a bucket list name that everyone wants to do. And it doesn’t matter how many times you talk to someone on the phone. They’re like, yeah, I mean, that other trip sounds great, but I want to do this one because I’ve heard it. And we’ve used language like.

Jason Elkins (11:45.572)
Mm-hmm.

you

Jason Elkins (11:52.591)
Mm-hmm.

Charlie (11:55.448)
quieter or less popular or you know and we’ve said we’ve switched it now to hidden so you got to try out the hidden track in the Alps it’s you know it’s there aren’t as many people and the refuge is a friendly error or whatever and all of a sudden people are hidden that sounds exciting it’s exactly

Jason Elkins (12:01.285)
Hmm.

Jason Elkins (12:12.409)
hidden off the beaten path or those types of terms that we use as opposed to less popular. That’s a tough one. Why would I want to go there?

Charlie (12:15.373)
Yeah.

Charlie (12:20.43)
Less popular, exactly. Yeah, or your second choice or your third choice. So it’s a fine line. And I’m guilty of this as well. I’ve got a business partner who’s based in the Chamonix office. He’s brilliant. He’s the operations guy. So he delivers the trips and helps build them. And he is your purist. He’s brilliant at… He knows the details. He knows the hidden everything. He knows…

the refuge owner in that remote part of Slovenia that no one’s ever heard of. Because he’s had a night out with them once in a refuge and they’ve shared whatever, goulash and a shot. But he forgets sometimes that I’m the client. So the trips that we build is what I want to go on and I’m time poor and I want an expert to tell me what I need to do. And I don’t want to necessarily spend 12 months researching

the intricacies, it’s tell me what’s best and I’ll go and do it. I understand from a client’s perspective, no, I’ve seen the Tour de Mont Blanc, that’s what I wanna do, I wanna climb Mont Blanc, as opposed to somebody suggesting, well actually maybe this would be better for you. So yeah, language is really important in how we talk to clients and position things.

Jason Elkins (13:31.524)
Yeah.

Jason Elkins (13:38.309)
curious. Do you? Well, there’s a few things that came up. But then the other interesting thing is if we’re too heavy on the word adventure. That can also scare away some people like some people want. Kind of want to know like, is it soft? OK, I can handle soft adventure. I don’t want to. I don’t want to climb a mountain. I don’t want to sleep on the ground. So if you are.

too mountaineering focused, and know, and you want to offer other products. If you only want to offer mountaineering, that’s fine. But if you want to offer other stuff, it’s a little bit of a balancing act. Because if you’re like, the ultimate mountain climbing adventure company, then it’s gonna be really hard to get people to book, you know, bicycling traps or or maybe lighter trekking trips and that type of thing. So it can be a challenge. I guess we’re all trying to figure out.

Charlie (14:32.331)
Yeah. Well, I mean, that’s, is part of the, the adventure in business that we all go on, is, is trying to work that out. And we’ve gone, our niche is the, European Alps. That is, know, some people follow a client. So if you, know, you did fly fishing, so let’s do trips around the world, fly fishing, because my client’s going to go from this one to this one. Whereas we’ve gone for geography and we’re like, well, we think we can be the best in the world.

the Alps, European Alps, because we know the best people and the best suppliers. so actually, it doesn’t to some extent, it doesn’t matter what the type of trip is. We know the routes, the transfers, people, the coffees, that, you know, all the intricacies that make up the hidden gems. Whether that’s right or wrong, time will tell. We don’t know, but it’s that’s the route we’ve

Jason Elkins (15:24.889)
Well, but even in that leads me to this. Do you work with, are you working business to business kind of as a DMC kind of boots on the ground type? So if, if there’s a travel agent or a tour operator in the U S that wants to put together a trip for some clients going to the Alps, do you work with them or do you only do direct to, the consumer or direct to the actual travelers?

Charlie (15:51.65)
Yes, we are your hybrid adventure travel office. Yeah. Yes. We, we, do the B the the direct to consumer stuff, but we are trying to do more and more of the, what we call B2B or I guess the DMC role or on the boots, sorry, on the ground with boots, positioning. So yes, if there’s any operators in the, in, in the U S North America who want to talk to us, we’d love to have a conversation.

Jason Elkins (15:54.209)
I thought you might be.

Jason Elkins (16:09.359)
Mm-hmm.

Charlie (16:18.126)
But and I think with our model that’s that’s That’s the way we create repeat clients is as I’ve said to you before that the B2C stuff the the director consumer They come and have a great trip with us. Our review suggests. They’re having a great trip with us But they’ve done it they’ve ticked it off and they want to go and do something else and and that’s great

Whereas the, if we can work with other operators who want to work with us, that’s amazing. Cause each year they come back and they’re like, great, we’ve got 10 new clients or 50 new clients.

Jason Elkins (16:50.287)
Yep. You did a great job last year for our clients. We’ve got some more that want to do it. So now you’re managing that. Yeah. That continuous relationship with an agent or an outbound operator, buyer, whatever, you know, whatever terminology you want to use, because even like when you said, okay, well, maybe you’re doing a fly fishing. You’ve got a fly fishing travel business and you go from place to place. go to all these different places around the world, but.

Charlie (16:54.839)
Exactly.

Jason Elkins (17:16.181)
As the tour operator selling those fly fishing trips, I’m working with operators on the ground that that no, you know, if you’re selling fly fishing trips around the world, I can’t hire all the guides and and arrange all the transfers and the hotels and the stuff all around the world. So I work with operators in those areas that do that really, really well. And I just happen to maybe have a following of people that like to go fly fishing. They trust me to find good places and they want to go with me. They don’t.

they don’t care who’s coordinating the transfers or who trained the guides as long as you know, it’s so not enough on that, I guess. Unless you have anything you want to add. Do you guys do any fly fishing? There’s some of that the Alps.

Charlie (17:56.718)
No, don’t. Yeah, mean, I absolutely I think we we can. Yeah, I mean, I actually I’ve got no idea whether you can fish in the Alps. Can you fish in the Alps? You must be able to.

Jason Elkins (18:07.877)
Well, there’s the Dolomites. Dolomites are in the hops, right? Dolomites? Yeah. Yeah. So.

Charlie (18:14.06)
Yeah, the Dolomites are beautiful and they are having their moment right now, the Dolomites. So if you are a flight company in the Dolomites, you’re probably doing quite well. It seems the place to go right now.

Jason Elkins (18:19.15)
Yeah?

Jason Elkins (18:22.884)
Yikes.

I that would be good. I think there’s some in Slovenia. We didn’t offer very much honestly. When I ran that business it was mostly South America, some Africa, Caribbean, stuff like that. anyway, I’m not sure. Well, I guess it just goes back to how do you define adventure, right? We’ve got some fly fishing guides and operators that have been on this show. It’s always such an interesting thing because I do some reach out and I get some referrals. I get a lot of referrals for the show from other people that have been on the show.

Oftentimes the response I get is, well, we’re not really an adventure travel company, but they do really cool food tours or they do multi-day jungle excursions. mean, it’s like, there’s so many cool things out there. I’ve just, I’ve gone to defining it as well. Here’s what it’s not. It’s, it’s not big cruise ships or all inclusive beach resorts. Anything else I’m willing to.

For me willing to consider that maybe it is adventure travel because we all have that, you know, it’s easier to say it that way.

Charlie (19:22.967)
Yes.

Yeah, yeah, it’s not just the activities, it’s the location or it’s the I mean, it could if you’re in a wild place, birdwatching, which arguably, it’s a isn’t necessarily adventure, but you’re having to cook your own food and it’s on a stove and there’s not much not many amenities. I mean, that’s that’s pretty adventurous, if you ask me. So, yeah, I don’t know.

Jason Elkins (19:39.704)
Mm-hmm.

Charlie (19:56.098)
I try not to, we love to try and create labels and box ourselves into it makes it easier doesn’t it to manage, but in reality we sell a service or build a service that people want and we try and make sure they have the best possible experience when they’re with us. So whether that’s adventure travel, holidays in the Alps, whatever anyone wants to call it. Yeah, our plan is to continue selling that service.

Jason Elkins (20:26.661)
All right, let’s get into the good stuff. Not that that’s not good stuff, but I really want to figure out how did you and I end up here having this conversation today? There’s probably a lot of things that happen along the way. So how far back do we need to go, Charlie, to get a feel for how you ended up getting from where you were to where you are now?

Charlie (20:28.706)
Yeah.

Charlie (20:43.914)
Ooh, a fair way actually. So 2010, where are we now? 2026. So.

Jason Elkins (20:52.869)
Okay, so that’s 16 years.

Charlie (20:56.046)
So that’s 16. Yeah. But at that stage I was, I would have been 21, 22, something like that. fresh out of university, went and did what a lot of Brits did back then, which is do a ski season or Brexit. And when it was a little easier to work abroad in Europe. So went and did a ski season in Chamonix in France and just fell in love with that environment.

Jason Elkins (21:05.508)
All right.

Jason Elkins (21:12.581)
Mm-hmm.

Jason Elkins (21:24.741)
So when you say did a ski season, does that mean like just went skiing or did you get a job as a ski instructor or a lift guy, a lifty? What is it called? Lifties? I think that’s what they called him in Montana.

Charlie (21:33.664)
Yeah, yeah, liftees. Yeah. So for the UK, a UK audience would probably understand what a ski season means. But for those that aren’t from the UK, a ski season tends to be during uni or post uni before you start getting what everyone would call a real job. You go in, do whatever you can work wise to have five months in the mountains where you get to ski and have fun, but you’re also working. So that could be

driving, that could be a chalet host, that could be a chef. You tend to get paid absolute peanuts, but you get everything thrown in. So you get your skis, you get your lift pass. There’s usually five of you in a one bed flat somewhere, but you don’t care because you’re just having a blast and you’re there to ski. So it’s work hard, play hard mentality, which is what I did. And I worked for a company called Adventure Base. they, and this goes back to the, to the origins of, of

Jason Elkins (22:26.149)
Hmm.

Charlie (22:31.532)
the company itself. at the time Adventure Base was a chalet holiday company. So they had five or six chalets in Chamonix specifically and families used to come out, stay in the chalets and I used to make sure they had a good time and took them to ski rental shops, told them where they need to go, picked up lift passes, basically looked after them. And I ended up loving it that much that I stayed there for five years. So

fortunately it was a small company. The guy who owned it was an accountant by trade, but an entrepreneur really. And I got to work really closely alongside this guy, but it was, it was a Shelly company at this point. But the, the, the, the, guess the genesis of business, I got to see how a small business works and the good stuff, the bad stuff, how the industry works, got to meet a lot of people. mean, Chamonix is a

big mountain town, but it’s small relative to normal towns. So you got to meet a lot of people and anyway, had a blast. And then I left at the end of five years because I wanted to set up my own business. was a trying to set up a tech company and mass participation sporting events. So I’ve always been active and enjoyed triathlons and obstacle course races and marathons. So tried to do that for three years.

Jason Elkins (23:56.197)
Charlie, let me ask you this before we move on, because I have a few questions about the original Adventure Base, Chamonix. Am I saying it right, Chamonix? Okay. First of all, you said you stayed five years. What were you doing in the summers? Is that still considered a ski? I don’t even know what you call

Charlie (24:06.348)
Yeah, correct.

Charlie (24:19.245)
Yeah.

Yeah, it’s a

Jason Elkins (24:22.277)
Talk to me more about the summers. The reason I’m asking is because we discussed fly fishing and in Montana and the Northern Rocky Mountains, you’ve got this interesting cycle of the fly fishing guides work in the ski business in the winter. So they’re doing the ski thing, they’re ski instructors, ski patrol, whatever in the winter, and then they’re fly fishing guides in summer. So I just had a curiosity, I have to ask you what was going on in the summers for you.

Charlie (24:38.562)
Hmm.

Charlie (24:47.758)
Yeah, so it flipped to looking after guests who coming out for summer holidays in the mountains. the guests were trekking or we were planning for the winter. I think at that time there was lots of snow in the Alps. So winter or skiing in the Alps was a big thing. And it was quieter in the summer. Now the business has completely flipped where we’re 95 % summer, 5 % winter.

Jason Elkins (24:53.582)
Okay.

Charlie (25:16.654)
And it’s a completely different model as well. yeah, I think it was the same job, but it was just, I was now doing it with sunshine and heat rather than snow and cold. So…

Jason Elkins (25:32.983)
Okay. But you didn’t have to, you didn’t have to go out and find a new job every five or six months or, switch between providers or have that two months of unemployment that people in Montana get for, you know, in between, in between seasons. But the other question I wanted to ask you is what did you go to school for? when you were younger thinking about going to school, was this stuff on your radar? What was, what was going on then?

Charlie (25:38.913)
No.

Charlie (25:46.092)
Yeah.

Charlie (26:00.098)
Yeah, I mean I was never great at school to be honest.

Jason Elkins (26:04.857)
You’re not the first one on this show to say that. There’s something about people that work in tourism that comes up so often. Go ahead.

Charlie (26:07.47)
Yeah, I think there’s that and there’s also, I don’t really know how I ended up where I am today, which I fall into the category of, but yeah, mean, I struggled, I found it hard. It wasn’t, it didn’t come natural. was, I mean, again, I was sporty. was, I had lots of friends. I really enjoyed school, but the academic stuff, the

sits and exams stuff that that’s not my cup of tea. so, and, in reality, back then it was a, it didn’t cost what it costs today. And it was the, what you did, you went to university. It was at the time the British government was really pushing it. Everyone needs higher education. And, and so I did, I should never have gone because it was more education and that’s, that’s not what I needed. so I, I studied geography and sports science, so you could argue.

Jason Elkins (27:02.063)
Yep.

Jason Elkins (27:06.455)
cool.

Charlie (27:07.274)
I was kind of putting it to good use now in a very loose way. yeah, as soon as I could start working in that type of environment, as in the with people in that world, mountains activity adventure, that’s probably where I felt a bit more confident in my ability and where I should be going.

Jason Elkins (27:11.301)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Jason Elkins (27:33.391)
Did you, did you realize like, let’s say when you were 15, 16 or you pick an age, was there a time in your life when you realized that, geez, people actually work in the outdoors or people can actually work in tourism and, and all this stuff. Or did you know about that? Was that something on your radar?

Charlie (27:51.951)
Yeah, not really. I don’t know what was… I don’t think there was much going through my head back at 15, 16 years ago. No, no, no, you won’t. Don’t worry. I’ve been doing this long enough to be an unoffendable or unembarrassable thing. But…

Jason Elkins (27:58.149)
Should we change the subject? I don’t want to put you on the spot or embarrass you, but…

Charlie (28:21.238)
Do you know what, think I was always, everybody said I was destined to become a teacher, right? So that was, that was my path. And then actually I did have a moment. Yeah, I think a PE teacher and that’s no offense to PE teachers out there, right? Sports science. Yeah, exactly. But actually I think I, so I never had a plan and I wasn’t one of those guys who was necessarily geared up towards a particular route.

Jason Elkins (28:29.325)
because you were such a good student right

okay. Well, you did go study sports recreation, right? Yeah, yeah, sports science.

Charlie (28:51.086)
But I did have a moment in life that changed a lot. So I was always active, loved being outdoors. And then in just before I went to Chamonix, so when was that? So when did I say 2010? So 2009, when I was 20, 21, my dad died randomly. So I think I was destined for this teaching career and I probably would have gone down it. And then something like that hits you and it was an out the blue moment and you start, I think,

it you think you start thinking more. So rather than just going through life, it’s such a kind of. Punch to the face moment, you have to stop and then you have to build everything back up again. And it made me think, well, what do I want? Where do I want to be? What is life to me? What’s important? And actually, the teaching route was what everyone was telling me I should be doing, not what I necessarily wanted to do. So.

Jason Elkins (29:24.463)
Mm-hmm.

Charlie (29:49.472)
My thought wasn’t, want to get into adventure travel or the outdoors. My thought is, I just want to have some fun. You I want to live a bit. And the most fun thing I could think of was let’s go and ski in the mountains in the winters and run and climb in the summers. So it was probably an escape. I’m probably still escaping right now. But it was geared around, okay, well, what is important to me? And let’s just do that for a bit.

Jason Elkins (30:11.033)
Yeah.

Jason Elkins (30:18.533)
Charlie, do you mind if I ask? You certainly can decide how to answer it,

When you looked at that situation with your dad, I can imagine a couple different scenarios and I don’t know because I wasn’t there, but you were. Sometimes when something like that happens, we might look at them and think, geez, they had a lot of regrets or maybe they were working really hard hoping to get to retirement so they could go enjoy life and then they didn’t make it. So I’m curious, was there something like that or what did you, what was the big takeaway other than, geez, my dad died and I don’t want to be a teacher?

Charlie (30:54.03)
Yeah, I think there was definitely an element, certainly more now, you know, I’ve got a young family myself, so I perhaps understand a bit more now, perhaps why my parents were living the life that they were living, but I think they got the balance pretty good, to be honest. I think it was…

I think it was a desire to just be like, you don’t know what’s around the corner. is. Yeah, you’re not sure what’s around the corner. And actually, you’ve got to you’ve just got to go for it. If there’s something you want to do, you’ve just got to try it. And actually, what’s the worst that can happen? Well, for me at that stage in my life, that was one of the worst things that could happen. And I’d had it and I’d lived through it. And so everything else was never going to be as bad. So you kind of had this

You were almost set free. Granted, it was a trauma and it wasn’t nice and all the other bits and pieces. But you had the freedom to be like, well, okay, it’s never going to be as bad as that. So let’s just try it, see what happens. I think the other thing as well, my dad always wanted to be his own boss. He was a doctor, loved being a doctor, but he wanted to be his own boss and have his own business. maybe there’s something on that. There’s something in that that…

laid on my mind but yeah I don’t think there was much more than let’s just go and have some fun because who knows what’s around the corner to be honest.

Jason Elkins (32:28.773)
Do you think, I don’t know, this is a tough question, but do you think that he would have supported your decision to go do what you did? That maybe, you know, I don’t know, that’s a question to ask, like, would he say, good for him, good for him. I’m so happy he didn’t go be a teacher. You know, I knew he didn’t really want to do that.

Charlie (32:48.106)
Do you know what? No, he would have been really annoying because he used to love these types of things. So he would have been out with me all the time. as long as he paid for his I wouldn’t have minded that. That would have been fine. No, yeah, I think he would have loved it. Now he would have loved it. I mean, what do you want for your kids ultimately? You want them to be secure and happy and safe and you know, I’m happy. I’m

Jason Elkins (32:57.453)
Yeah.

Jason Elkins (33:02.701)
huh.

Charlie (33:14.86)
The business is bigger now, so we’re relatively secure. you know, I think, I think maybe at the beginning, a bit nervous, a bit, a bit scared, but I think he would have found it fascinating and interesting and got all the trips and all the other bits and pieces. So, yeah, I’m pretty, I’m pretty confident he’d be, he’d be, he’d, he would have enjoyed the journey, but I wouldn’t have been doing it. Probably I’d be a teacher right now. Again, nothing wrong with teaching. It just wasn’t for me.

Jason Elkins (33:24.409)
Yeah.

Jason Elkins (33:37.657)
Well, that’s, that’s, that’s the interesting thing, right? Is, he really left you a legacy in a way. even after, even immediately after that caused you to make some decisions. You use the words, everybody wants their kids to be secure and happy. And I’m thinking, boy, that’s a, sometimes those are, there’s challenges with those words, right?

Because security, you know, is a major human need and some people need it more than others and others need adventure and spontaneity. it’s a complicated mix to find, you know, like in my head, I know that I should want to be secure. I know that I should do certain things to provide for my future, but man, in my actions, I don’t see that happening. I’m like, no, I want to go.

Charlie (34:03.022)
Thank

Charlie (34:30.062)
Thank

Jason Elkins (34:30.167)
experience this and do that and like security like if if if I’m in a relationship and she’s talking about security I’m like my god you’re boring I gotta get away from you that’s just me I don’t know about you

Charlie (34:41.198)
Yeah, I mean, you’re No, you’re right, actually. I mean, I definitely haven’t taken a secure path. So don’t quite know why I said secure, but now I’m a father, it’s different. Yeah, I know.

Jason Elkins (34:52.399)
Well, society tends to tell us that’s the most important thing. The most important thing is to be secure and stable. And especially when you start thinking about having families and kids and that’s where it can get pretty complicated. So I can see how something like that with your dad might cause you to say, hey, let’s take a minute and…

Charlie (35:11.51)
Yeah, I don’t know why I said secure actually. Probably because you want your kids to have a comfortable life, don’t you? But you know in order to have a comfortable life you’ve got to experience some pain. I mean it’s getting an oxymoron or whatever the word is. can’t have one without the other. I want them to be happy. Let’s just stick with that. Just want them to be happy, whatever that is. Right, let’s remove the secure.

Jason Elkins (35:26.382)
It’s

Jason Elkins (35:36.889)
There we go. Okay, I wasn’t suggesting there was anything wrong with it. I mean, I just recognize that it’s a challenge that we all kind of have is balancing that. And especially when we all have different levels of what’s important. We discussed the word adventure earlier. You know, one of my definitions for adventure is kind of getting outside your comfort zone, getting outside your box.

Charlie (35:50.232)
Yeah.

Jason Elkins (36:02.413)
Right. And so if that’s eating scorpions on the street in Thailand, that might be an incredible, credible adventure type of experience. If you’ve always been the type that ate chicken nuggets and with smothered in ketchup, you know, so, so, but that’s where, I guess, you know, that, that people find security in eating chicken nuggets, I guess that’s what I’m saying. Right. Because they know what to expect. It’s a, it’s, it’s.

part of their routine, their pattern, and a lot of it comes from family. And then we’ve got people that go into these businesses and there’s, you know, it’s an interesting to have different conversations with people that some of them came from families that were super worried about security to the point where the child is like, my gosh, I got to get out of here. This is, you know, I can’t stand this. And then they go off and, you know, join the circus and become a mountain climbing guide or whatever. And the parents don’t understand. And

So anyway, what about your what about your family? So you’ve got you said you are married with kids. Plural or how many?

Charlie (37:08.396)
Yeah, too. So married with a seven year old and a five year old. So now that is the biggest adventure that I’ve. Yeah, it’s quite the it’s quite the learning curve.

Jason Elkins (37:10.041)
Wow.

Jason Elkins (37:16.735)
Yeah. Was, was your wife into the outdoors and adventure stuff? she, grasp ahold of this lifestyle easily or has it been, has that been a challenge?

Charlie (37:33.486)
Well, she works in the company. yeah, we’re, yeah, we live together, raise our children together and work together. And actually it’s part, part of the reason for the adventure of ACE V2. So I was boring you with the, I guess the gap where I left. then, and then when I came back is at that point, I had one kid, one on the way. This is 2020. So yeah, one kid, one on the way.

Jason Elkins (37:35.94)
Okay.

Charlie (38:03.374)
a mortgage and the guy who owned a venture base, full plans of security, you know, all those…

Jason Elkins (38:08.037)
All kinds of security probably, right? You mentioned IT business or startups and launches. Yeah. Okay.

Charlie (38:16.118)
Yeah, exactly. you know, I just landed a good job or just interviewed for a job that I thought great is a nice career path here and what you know, maybe that’s my lot. Maybe that’s what I’m just gonna do. I’m gonna work my way up and build a nice company for life. And this this accountant who I originally worked for came to me this is pre COVID. And he said, Look, I’m looking at my businesses and I’m trying to sort them out and

Adventure Base at that stage had moved into a adventure travel company. So it merged with a company called Dream Guide. Long story, different story. I’m not going to bore you with it. And he said, I think you’d be, well, I think you’d be really good at running it. Would you be interested in it? And I said, yes, but I’d need to have ownership and I need to have majority ownership. And anyway, we were negotiating that. And this was at the time I’d just been offered this secure job with this other

company, you know, and all these responsibilities that I had. And I remember sitting at the kitchen table and I was arguing that I should do the secure thing. That is what I should do. You know, I’ve got.

Jason Elkins (39:23.685)
That’s why the word secure came up 10 minutes ago. We’re getting to the bottom of this here. There really is that secure or unhappy. Okay, go ahead.

Charlie (39:26.414)
Yeah, we’re there. You’ve done. Yeah, you are. It’s. Yeah. Well, yeah. And I remember sitting on my table. I was convincing myself and everyone around me. This is what I should do. And my wife looked at me and she said, well, there is no decision here, is there? There is only one decision and you got to take adventure base. And I looked at it like.

What you know the person I thought who’d be saying to me take the secure job, you know, pay the mortgage make sure that you know I’ve got I’m growing your child and seven months pregnant. There’s a child in here. You got to look after another one And she was like what’s a no-brainer yet? You have to do it and all the big decisions in my life have been made by my wife so the best decision I ever made not that you’ve asked me that question is the the person you decide to spend share your life with because she has made all the big decisions in my life and

without her saying let’s do it then I don’t think well we wouldn’t we probably wouldn’t be here I’d be secure

Jason Elkins (40:29.189)
That’s what I was hearing when you were telling me that she said, there’s only one choice. That my immediate thought was, wow, where do you find, where are we to find one of those? then the thought came up, maybe you should start another spin-off business where you can be a dating relationship coach for men and help guys that really like adventure stuff. Maybe guys that actually work in the adventure industry to help pair them up with women that will be supportive.

Charlie (40:39.372)
Yeah.

Jason Elkins (40:59.301)
and won’t try and get them to quit their job and buy a house and, you know, quit their job as a guy to go get a real job, that type of thing. All right, just another business idea maybe. I’m not sure.

Charlie (41:05.774)
Thank you.

Charlie (41:10.068)
Yeah, yeah, you’ll have to speak to my wife because she’s the powerhouse.

Jason Elkins (41:15.341)
Yeah, you could ask her what she thinks. I love it. That’s so cool. Very lucky.

Charlie (41:20.66)
so yes, so she, yeah, yeah, I am very lucky. and it is quite the adventure working with your wife and living with your wife and, you know, the stresses of running a business, especially in adventure travel business, because nothing goes to plan ever. but, but actually that is, I’ve got, I’ve actually got two wives really, or partners. I’ve got my wife, my wife, wife, and then I’ve got Olly, my business partner, who is, might as well be my wife. you know, he is, in fact, my wife has said to me,

Well, now, many times I can say in the 30 seconds, but my wife has said.

Jason Elkins (41:54.255)
Charlie, you were doing so good in this conversation. And I was thinking your wife’s gonna be so happy to hear this. You’re really being nice talking about how she’s the powerhouse. And then you started talking about your second wife and I thought, boy, it’s going so well.

Charlie (42:10.009)
No, but she’s aware. Look, we’re open about it. She says the only person I’m worried about you leaving me for is Oli, who’s my business partner.

Jason Elkins (42:14.181)
Okay. That’s a different podcast, Charlie. That’s a different podcast. All right. Go ahead. Your business wife.

Jason Elkins (42:28.901)
Uh-huh.

Charlie (42:29.742)
And I turn around to him and say, you should be because I, this is where I’m very lucky is that the person, know, the person you choose to spend your life with is I think the most important decision. If you get into business, the most important decision you make in business is the person you partner with. So in this case, Ollie, um, and, um, I love doing adventure base with Ollie. He’s brilliant at what he does and we have a lot of fun doing it. Um, and, um, and

I think that chemistry and that, and we’re very different people, know, strengths and weaknesses and all that. We’ve been very lucky with key people in my life who have helped me or helped a venture base get to where we are now.

Jason Elkins (43:14.639)
Sounds like it. Is he in, or I should ask you, are you in the UK? Cause you mentioned you’ve got an office in the UK and the one in France. Where were you located?

Charlie (43:21.366)
Yeah, so.

So yeah, so I’m UK, so we’re in a seaside town called North, well, seaside county, North Devon, and probably the most famous place to where the office is is a place called Croid, or Ulfricum or Wulucum, it’s a surf town. you find lots of interesting people here, surf holidays, chosen to live here.

and then Oli is running the Chamonix office in Chamonix. So we kind of have a split team.

Jason Elkins (43:58.534)
Okay, and then did your wife get involved in the business right away as well?

Charlie (44:04.15)
Not right away. She was our… Yeah, she did. The other thing just to add to the mix was I still can’t believe she said I should do a venture based because she was seven or eight months pregnant. My son was in a cast, a full leg cast, because I had thrown him up and dropped him.

Jason Elkins (44:06.629)
She kind of had her hands full. It’s like you had a young one and one on the way, right?

Charlie (44:33.794)
by social services listening. One of those horrible moments where, yeah, I was clear. I was cleared of all charges. was, it was definitely an accident, but you know, so she, she was, I don’t quite know how I got the, the, the all clear. Anyway, so the first, the first year of venture based V2 was, it was COVID. So we had a lot of time to think and plan and

Jason Elkins (44:34.437)
Yeah.

Man anything else you want to disclose here?

Charlie (45:02.838)
nothing was really happening. And then the next year we started to get a bit of traction. The year after we employed our first person, then our next person, and we’re now currently a team of 12 across all the different offices. And the plan is to, 12 full time, and then we obviously have our guides that we bring in and our seasonal staff. the plan is to continue to grow and…

and maybe be triple the size if we get to where we want to. But I can’t remember your original question now, Jason.

Jason Elkins (45:39.717)
Well, was just as far as your wife, like when did she get involved? Cause you mentioned that you guys are working together now. So I’m just kind of curious what that, how long that’s been happening and what that is actually like. mean, honestly, it sounds like you’ve got a great wife and you’ve been very, very lucky, but I, but I worked with.

Charlie (45:55.566)
I feel like you’re trying to trap me here Jason.

Jason Elkins (45:59.59)
No, you’re doing pretty good. You’re doing pretty good at this by yourself. just I’m just providing you with opportunities to trap yourself.

Charlie (46:07.054)
Yeah, well, she, she joined, she was our third hire and it was a hire of necessity. And I mean that in the nicest possible way. I think that at that stage, I just moved back to the UK. A few reasons for that. One, we wanted to bring the family up. My wife wants to bring the family up in the UK, missed home, missed family. and also, Brexit has added some complications with UK companies and Europe and other bits and pieces. so now we’re.

Jason Elkins (46:16.709)
You

Jason Elkins (46:35.939)
I noticed you started to say, wanted to bring our kids up in the UK and then you quickly corrected yourself. Anyway, as you were saying about Brexit.

Charlie (46:41.934)
Yeah. Yeah. And, yeah, I’ll hide mine. Brexit. It’s always a good discussion point, but, so she, needed somebody to help with sales immediately. And she’s, she’s really, she, she had done most of the tracks. She’d done the climbs. You she knew the product really well. she’s really good with people. So it was quite a simple process. We, she just started helping out with the sales process was really good at it.

and is still doing it now. and it’s, it’s good. There are good and bad things about working with your partner. We have rules. So she can’t tell me anything after nine o’clock that’s happened. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, you’ve got to get it in at breakfast.

Jason Elkins (47:25.995)
in the morning. That’s a good rule. I endorse that one. Yeah, we’re not going to talk about work after 9am. You do your thing, I’m going to do my thing.

Charlie (47:40.782)
But you know, little things like that. If you tell me at nine and I’m in bed or 10, I’m going to have to do something about it. And it’s really annoying. I, you know, unless the place is on fire, don’t tell me, I’ll deal with it in the morning. You have to make sure that you don’t, you try and leave your personal life out of the office. So, you know, let’s not talk about the kids or the, what we’re doing after work or, know, those…

Try and maintain that doesn’t mean you can’t bring in your personal life because everybody does but it’s just it’s not the Harriet and Charlie show It’s the it’s a venture base and we I mean, I think it’s just a respect for the business and respect for one another And and what is lovely is I think and this is the subtle thing about working with your partner because she knows me so well there are very stressful times when running a business and and And the way I react with stress as I go quiet

And I just need a few hours to decompress or write notes or lists or just deal with it. And I don’t have to, she just knows because she knows what’s going on at work. She knows where I’m at and she just, she’ll grab the kids and take them out or she’ll say, just go for a run. Here are your trainers or just go and take a couple of hours and come back to us because she understands the scenario. you, you.

I don’t have to try and explain, look, I need to get this done because of… and she’s like, yeah, but I have to get this done because of my work. So there’s an understanding there. But yeah, it’s…

Jason Elkins (49:14.703)
What’s the, think, I think you touched on a couple of interesting things. And if somebody’s listening to that, well, let me, let’s paint the picture. It sounds like you’re saying your office is like a home-based office.

Charlie (49:27.796)
No, we’ve got both. The one in Canada is Tristan, he’s co-working there. And then in the UK we have a team of five and we’ve got an office here and we’ve got a Chamonix based office as well. So yeah, we do have an office.

Jason Elkins (49:46.981)
But as far as you working with your wife, are you guys, you leave the house in the morning and go to an office? Okay, that’s probably a, what’s that?

Charlie (49:53.058)
Yep, separate cars, separate cars as well. We go in separate cars. Yeah, so it’s a whole.

Jason Elkins (49:59.792)
To me that sounds brilliant. But I’m curious, you’ve been doing it longer than I haven’t had it. I had a scenario where I managed a fly fishing and scuba diving lodge with my wife at the time. And we were 30 miles offshore off the coast of Belize and it was a total, it was a pressure cooker like you wouldn’t imagine. So working together was not such a pleasant thing. There was no way to get away. But in your, I guess what I want to ask you is,

Charlie (50:02.797)
Yeah.

Jason Elkins (50:28.473)
If somebody’s listening to this considering maybe working with their spouse, what are the top two or three pieces of advice you would give them in general that you’ve learned?

Charlie (50:40.77)
Don’t do it is my No, I mean, that’s the obvious that’s in the shape I mean, look, it’s, it’s obviously not for everyone. I think it’s, it’s everything that you’d apply to a business. So it’s communication first and foremost, right? It’s we went into this and we were quite clear. said, let’s try it. If it doesn’t work, we can both walk away. And it’s whatever we’ll

Jason Elkins (50:42.597)
Okay, all right. No, that’s very valid. Yeah.

Charlie (51:11.16)
we’ll choose a new career path for you. But it’s very much a case of this is a trial period, like a probation period with a new employee. So communication definitely would be one of my top tips. Another one would be, I think, create some rules. Like I said, nothing after nine o’clock. Try and put your phone, try not to bring it back home unless…

If we’re in the car driving somewhere, we’ve got nothing else to do, we’ll talk about it. But if I’m at home with the kids and we’re trying to balance things, put your phone down. It’s no different to anyone else at home with a young family. Put your phone down, help me out. So I think just create some general rules.

my third tip. don’t know, be prepared to pull the plug if it’s not working perhaps. Just don’t let it affect you.

Jason Elkins (52:05.573)
on one of the jobs. When you say pull the plug, that could mean a few different things, but you’re saying maybe, guess that’s the thing is, do you have that planned in advance for you? Maybe it’s easy because you kind of, you you’re running the business. As soon as it became version two, you were running it, ownership in it. And then she obviously was already there, but now she’s an employee.

Charlie (52:10.958)
Yeah.

Jason Elkins (52:29.391)
Presumably if you guys decide you know what this working together things not working. She will go find another job But I’m curious is that do you think that it’s important to have that in place? Before you go into a scenario where you’re working together where like there’s an agreement that okay if this doesn’t work out you’re the one that’s got to go find the other job or It seems like I would be important

Charlie (52:49.294)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think in our scenario where it was a case of I was the boss owner and she was coming in to help. the balance there was if it doesn’t work, you go and find a job. I mean, it’s just. Yeah, exactly.

Jason Elkins (52:58.437)
Hmm?

Jason Elkins (53:05.381)
Yeah, I was kind of already kind of already set up, but you can see you could see two people that work for the same company as accountants. They’re working from home in the home office, working together for the same company. And and they’re like, well, no, I’m not going to quit my job. You go find a job. No, I’m not going to quit the job. You go find it.

Charlie (53:22.606)
I think that’s more complicated isn’t it? Or if you start the business together and you are both owners.

Jason Elkins (53:30.019)
Ooh, yeah, that’s probably the toughest scenario.

Charlie (53:33.122)
I we’ve always, I guess we’ve always had her, my priority is of course the family, but my priority as a unit, me and my wife is work, know, is to develop the business, is to create a lifestyle that we want. Her focus, and she says it to me, is we’ll always be the family. And that’s what she wants to focus more of her energies on. So there is that power. I come home and the kids call Harriet the boss, whereas at work I’m the boss.

Jason Elkins (53:46.213)
Mm-hmm.

Jason Elkins (53:54.937)
That’s cool. That’s cool.

Jason Elkins (54:00.422)
Mm-hmm.

Charlie (54:02.252)
So there’s a, you know, I know my place. I know my place.

Jason Elkins (54:05.765)
And then every once, and then every once in a while, I imagine she reminds you of that conversation at the kitchen table when you were trying to decide where you’re to go, the secure route or go with adventure base. I’m sure.

Charlie (54:14.274)
Yeah.

Charlie (54:18.606)
Well, and I say it’s your fault, you know, I’m stressed because of you you made this cool I could have had a relaxed. Well, I mean there is

Jason Elkins (54:22.201)
Ha ha ha ha!

Jason Elkins (54:26.181)
I could have been playing golf three hours a day and driving a company car. Oh, fun, fun stuff. Um, you guys, you, don’t know why this has come to mind right at the moment. It’s a little bit back to kind of the business model and what you guys are doing. I think early on when I asked you, what is adventure base? I think you said you do just bespoke or custom.

There’s a bunch of different words bespoke, custom, FITs. for like a specific, a family, a couple, something like that. Do you do group departures of any sort? If I went on your website and I wanted to climb Mount Blanc, could I sign up with a group that’s going to do that or just curious.

Charlie (55:14.05)
Yeah. Yeah. So I’d say the majority of, well, we started with group trips. So if you wanted to climb Mont Blanc, that’s what the majority of people will do. They’ll come and join one of our groups as an individual or as, as a two or, but we do get, yep. so we have, and we have that for trekking. So have guided tracks, we have, guided climbs, we have guided ski tours. And for the most part, people will come as, as individuals or groups of friends and join a group trip.

Jason Elkins (55:29.861)
you do have grips, okay?

Charlie (55:44.416)
And then we have the, the custom trips. that’s, whether it’s a B2B or a B2C, they’ll come to us and say, there’s 50 of us. Can you build something for us? we’ve, we’ve had, corporate, lots of different corporate trips out. had, we’ve had Virgin out with us. We’ve actually taken Richard Branson’s the top of Mont Blanc, which was, yeah, quite a, quite a fun experience. so.

Jason Elkins (56:07.397)
nice.

Charlie (56:12.75)
Yeah, a whole mix really and we’re doing more and more self-guided stuff. So I don’t quite know where that fits. It’s obviously it’s off the shelf stuff, but you’re not part of a group. Yeah, we’re doing more of that and we really like that as a model as a it seems to be what more and more people are interested in.

Jason Elkins (56:34.469)
Right. There’s there used to be back in the day, this company that did a lot of hot air ballooning and the, there’s still people that do it in the ops, but there’s this one called the buddy bombard society, I think. And they used to offer like, I don’t know, seven to 10 day trips and the ops, would go from place to place and then they would fly balloons in the mornings. And I don’t, I don’t know why I’m bringing that up because in addition to fly fishing also have a very.

Charlie (56:48.354)
Wow, what are they doing?

Jason Elkins (57:03.607)
specific interest in hotter ballooning for anybody that’s listened to the show for a while as knows that I grew up around ballooning. And for some reason, I just felt the urge to ask you, are they still around? Do you recognize that name? Do you guys do any ballooning stuff?

Charlie (57:16.366)
No, but it sounds like you and I need to have a conversation off camera because we need to add fly fishing and ballooning to our

Jason Elkins (57:23.205)
I think so, I’m a little biased.

Charlie (57:25.87)
I mean the ballooning, that’s quite niche. How did that all come about?

Jason Elkins (57:34.554)
I don’t know the whole story. just remember that I grew up. Well, I remember my story. I don’t know the buddy Bombard society story. My story was that my father back in the day when I was 10 or 11 years old, he was an accountant, quit his job as an accountant and convinced worked out a deal with the state of Wyoming to buy a hot air balloon so he could go travel the world promoting tourism to the state of Wyoming. So it was a big yellow balloon with a brown bucking horse on it, which was kind of the state symbol and

So I spent my formative years traveling around in the pickup truck with my dad and my brother and our dog going from balloon festival to balloon festival every weekend. So anyway, but I remember during that time I’d seen some pictures of these balloons in Europe and the Alps and just thought it was fascinating. And I just remember the name and I’d met a couple of people that had worked with them on some level. And was just, I just was curious. I don’t think they’re still around, but I don’t know anyway.

Charlie (58:30.882)
haven’t I haven’t heard or seen I mean there’s so many yes an amazing name I think the problem is there’s so many paraporters and wingsuiters and helicopters going up and down the valleys it’s perhaps not

Jason Elkins (58:33.731)
Cool name though, right?

Jason Elkins (58:41.989)
you

Jason Elkins (58:46.853)
Yeah, well, and that’s where we go back into that conversation of soft adventure and hard adventure. There’s the wing suitors and then there’s the balloonists. Two totally different ends of the spectrum, I think. But anyway, I guess I do want to ask one more question about the Alps and about, you know, potentially clients that maybe are reaching out to you. There’s probably two or three things that maybe surprise people or that you think that

Charlie (58:53.646)
The cloud. Yeah.

Yeah.

Jason Elkins (59:16.645)
I guess the question is two or three pieces of short advice to somebody that’s thinking about going to the Alps to maybe do something adventurous. Like, what should they know?

Charlie (59:29.708)
Yeah, so I think the preconception of the Alps and the fact that it’s in Europe is that everything runs really smoothly and it’s like a Swiss watch and the beauty of the Alps is that you have this mix of cultures in a small area because you’ve obviously got

Jason Elkins (59:43.439)
Like a Swiss watch.

Yeah, I’ve heard that.

Charlie (59:58.668)
Switzerland, Austria, Germany, France. mean, the Tour de Mont Blanc is a great example. You spend 11 days trekking around three countries and you know the moment that you stepped into a different country, even though you’re sharing the same geography, the same mountain, it’s different. So I would say that you should be aware that not all countries do the same things the same ways.

The Italians are brilliant hosts. And if you go to one of their refuges, they will, the foods great. They’re at the energy is great. The Swiss are efficient. They are structured. The refuges are clean and tidy and exactly as you’d expect. And then the French refuges come with sometimes a little bit of

personality that can be misconstrued as… It’s understanding that they might be direct with you or there’s a certain French way of doing things and you have to admire it. So I think you have to go with an open mind. Do not expect an American service mentality because you do not get that in Europe. And it’s part of the charm, right? It’s part of the charm. Refugees are…

Jason Elkins (01:01:00.185)
You’re being really tactful. You’re doing good.

Jason Elkins (01:01:23.088)
Do you think it’s important for people to consider this before, like when they’re trying to figure out where to go? Is that critical or is it just understanding before you get there that what’s realistic to expect?

Charlie (01:01:38.35)
I think both really. think if you’re someone, mean, there’s lots of different ways of doing these things. So again, I keep referring to this trek, mostly because it’s a good example of the variety you have in the Alps. We have some amazing hotels, family run hotels, super comfortable en suites, great food. And you can do the treks staying in those, or you can do the treks staying in refuges where there’s no showers and you’re in a dorm room with 20 other people.

The food is basic because you’re 3000 meters up in a mountain somewhere and the only way to get to you is via helicopter or by foot. I think if you are someone who likes comfort, great, then choose a destination or choose a trip that provides comfort. If you are someone who is really looking for adventure or escapism or something different, then choose the refuge route. And if you’re someone in between, then create

something in between, but I mean, this is perhaps going to sound like it’s planned. It’s not. The reason I think our clients are very, are often very happy with the service we deliver is because we know we’ve taken enough clients around these trips to understand through our questioning and time we spend with them, what is right for them and building a mix of comfort and adventure and not making, making sure they don’t.

try and do too much in a short period of time. So expert advice and using that expert advice I think is really important.

Jason Elkins (01:03:14.457)
What is, I’m curious what that looks like for you because we’re doing a, we’re having this podcast conversation, but we’re doing it on a video call. You know, for me, I find it makes it easier to connect. Even if we’re not going to publish a video, I still like to be able to see the person I’m speaking with. is that helpful? Is that something you guys do in the sales process? If you’ve got somebody wanting to set up a big truck for their family or climb a mountain, do you think that’s an important part?

Do you do that all the time? Some of the time? What are your thoughts on that? Or maybe it’s not important at all. I don’t know.

Charlie (01:03:47.722)
No, it’s definitely important. And it’s not all the time. It’s some of the time and it’s trip dependent. So we tend to speak to most of our ski tourers because there’s a very technical specific trip that somebody’s joining and they’ve got to have the right level of ski ability, ski touring ability, physical fitness. there’s almost a, not anyone can join mentality in a safe way. We don’t want to sell a trip. You turn up day one, the guide says you’re not ready. And all of a sudden,

you paid for a seven day trip and you can’t do anything else because it’s not safe. Whereas with something like the trekking, especially with the families, we will often get on the phone to them and say, all right, what are you looking for? How old are your kids? What have you done before? What’s important to you? How long have you got? All those types of questions. you can get a flavor from, well, one, you’re building a relationship, which is important, but you can also get a flavor of someone’s experience and ability. And our adventure advisors, we call them, they…

Jason Elkins (01:04:20.261)
Yeah, yeah.

Charlie (01:04:46.092)
they tend to do that. And our adventure advisors have done the trips so they can go, okay, that section is really steep or that section’s, do you like exposure? Okay, well maybe we’ll reroute you or you should definitely do this if you like exposure because the lad is on whatever.

Jason Elkins (01:05:04.793)
You know, it’s, interesting because I think so, maybe so many of your clients, or at least in my vision, people that, that buy trips, a lot of them work or have worked, maybe they’re retired now, but they’ve lived a life of having people trying to sell them stuff. And we’re in a culture right now. If, know, if somebody reaches out to me and says, Hey, let’s, let’s jump on a call. I immediately think, except for what I’m doing, it’s a little different, but.

I might think, the sales call, going to, they don’t want to get me on the call so they can close me so they can get my credit card before I get off the phone. And if they don’t get my credit card before I get off the call, then they’re going to ignore me and they’re going to go on to the next person. So they go through their daily lives at work, trying to avoid getting on a call with anybody because they don’t want to get sold anything. And then maybe they hear you and I saying, yeah, if you want to book it, you know, if you want to go to the Alps.

Maybe you should get on a video call with one of Charlie’s advisors. so I want to, that’s why I wanted to bring this up. So what would you say to them to kind of ease their concerns about this? Isn’t it? Cause you, think you already started to describe it well, but what would you want to say to them? The person that’s thinking, no, I don’t need to do a video call. I just send an email and say that we can just discuss this by email. I don’t want to feel pressured.

Charlie (01:06:24.654)
Yeah, and that’s fine. We do that also. our sales technique process is not really a sales technique. It’s more an info. I mean, my personal belief is that what the majority of our cell, there are other providers. So people are going to shop around and ultimately they’re going to choose what they feel most comfortable with. So there is no point trying the pressure. Sorry, there’s no point trying the pressure techniques or

making someone feel uncomfortable because it doesn’t work anymore. In my opinion, it’s not the way we sell anymore or people buy. So if people want to email, that’s fine. If they want a phone call, that’s fine. We’ll go back and forth. We just need information so we can build a trip for you and present what we would consider to be the best option. We often build people trips, send it to them.

If they wanted to do it themselves, they could do it. They have all the information. We give them the information. We tell them the hotels, we tell them the distances. So, but that’s, and that’s fine. If they want to go and do it by themselves, that’s completely fine because we were never right for them in the first place. But if people want to remove the administrative headache, if they want the security of having someone there when something goes wrong, which it always does, then that’s where somebody like us.

comes into their own. There are, of course, if you’re going to climb Mont Blanc, you need a guide and we can provide all that, but certainly the self-guided treks. kind of have this, here’s the information, take it or leave it. What I do say to our adventure advisors is we are very lucky because on a Monday morning we have an inbox full of inquiries.

that people have reached out to us and they’ve got one or two questions or they want to call or whatever. We get to pick up the phone on a Monday morning and say, hey, it’s Charlie from Adventure Base. You messaged us about climbing Mont Blanc. No one, no one goes, why are you calling me? Like this is, it’s Monday morning, right? We’re not selling pens. We’re selling things people want to do, which is really exciting. yeah, great. Can I, yeah, I’ve got two minutes now. Or can we, can you call me at one?

Jason Elkins (01:08:32.055)
Yeah.

Charlie (01:08:48.078)
I’m like, it’s just, it’s so cool. Yeah. And I say, should feel so lucky. There is no, this is something people want, right? They don’t need it. They want it. So they don’t.

Jason Elkins (01:08:48.705)
I know it’s so cool, right?

Jason Elkins (01:08:57.689)
Right. They reached out specifically to you guys and said, I’m interested in this. This is what I’m trying to accomplish. They’re excited to talk to you. It’s not like they got an insurance, you know, car insurance quote over the weekend and accidentally put their email address and phone number into the wrong website. Now on Monday morning, they’ve got 42 real estate salespeople calling. Hey, see that you’re interested in getting insurance. Let’s, you know, it’s like, my God.

Charlie (01:09:17.176)
Yeah.

Charlie (01:09:25.794)
Yeah. And I, and yeah, and we, and I get calls, I get cold calls all the time and I feel sorry. it’s, but, but, but we don’t get to do that. And the other thing that I think is important is we don’t discount. We, we don’t like the idea of someone being on a trip who’s paid less than someone who’s got the same, exactly the same value. sorry, the exact same service as someone else, but they’ve paid more or less. So we don’t discount. There’s no.

Jason Elkins (01:09:26.405)
There’s actually people that do that type of work. I know.

Charlie (01:09:55.138)
conversation around discounting. It’s this is what we believe to be our value. It’s fair for everyone. We think it’s good value for you. And I think that also removes that salesmanship. You know, can I, can you do a hundred quid offer? It’s like, look, we don’t discount. This is the price.

Jason Elkins (01:10:14.143)
Because a company that’s discounting is kind of admitting that, we overpriced someone else. Right? Because if you’re discounting to make the trip work, that means half the people you overcharged, the other half now you’re under. So why not just pick a good price in the beginning? That’s fair, right? It sounds like what you guys have come up to. Yeah, that’s cool.

Charlie (01:10:23.086)
Yeah.

Charlie (01:10:35.596)
Yeah.

I think, yeah, I think it’s also easier administratively as well. there is a, I just, don’t get, I don’t like everything about discounting makes me feel, I mean, don’t get me wrong when I’m shopping around, I like a discount, but yeah.

Jason Elkins (01:10:50.437)
Isn’t that weird? Yeah, I get it. But you and I have both also been around.

say this but sometimes the the people that respond to discounts don’t always appreciate and value what you do for them as much for some reason I don’t know I don’t that’s maybe a whole conversation for another day but yeah so we’re gonna move on from that Charlie we’ve discussed a bunch of bunch of things I know that we could keep going and discuss a whole bunch more I’m curious though what did I forget to ask you or what do you wish that I would have asked you

That you want to make sure our listeners know either about you, Adventure Base, the Alps, life in general, anything like that before we wrap up.

Charlie (01:11:36.87)
no, I don’t think, I think you’ve asked, I think you’ve asked us everything. yeah, we, maybe our mission, what, what we’re, what we’re trying to do and for us at Adventure Base, we, said at the beginning, we’re experts in the Alps. We help you adventure like a local. our mission is to paint the Alps orange.

For those that haven’t been on our website, our website’s got an orange. It’s one of our core colors. So we talk about painting the Alps orange with guides and our clients. And we just want to help more people get into the mountains now and for the next generation. Something we’re working on is project next generation internally. We’re not quite sure exactly how that looks, but it’s all about how are we leaving the Alps.

European Alps in a better state for the next generation, whether it’s social, environmental, helping people just experience it. We know the types of trips we felt very lucky that what we sell is what will hopefully stay with someone forever and maybe when they’re 80 years old and in their armchair and maybe they’ve got grandkids, maybe they’re just having a drink with an old friend.

hopefully they tell the story of the trip that they came on with us. They won’t remember us but they’ll remember the memories they took and I think that’s you know that’s pretty cool. So we’re trying to do that for more people really.

Jason Elkins (01:13:08.837)
But you know, you say they won’t remember us, but I bet they’ll remember some of the guides that you connected with them with or your trip leaders. I do believe that. think that that’s they might not remember the name of the company, but they’ll remember sitting on, you know, around a campfire, having a conversation with one of these guys and or ladies. So that’s pretty cool.

Charlie (01:13:27.982)
We did a big review of all our reviews recently for marketing purposes and the number one thing that came out in all our reviews was the guides and or a team member that it was the people. Everyone will say the reason I’m going on this trip is for the environment or the adventure. When they finish it, if you ask them the same question, they will say the best thing about the trip was the guide or the people I was with or somebody I met. And it’s always the people that make it.

adventure’s great, adventures shared are better, that’s what we say internally so yeah you’re absolutely right.

Jason Elkins (01:14:00.334)
Mm-hmm.

It really is because I have a long felt that you can drop me in the most amazing spectacular place on the planet. And if I’m there by myself. It might be beautiful, but me personally, I’m just not going to enjoy it the same. It’s like, you know what I mean?

I want to connect with a guide or somebody in my group or, you know, some family member or something. It’s just so much more special when we, for me anyway, I know there’s people that do solo trips and climb mountains by themselves to stand on top of the mountain to connect with themselves, presumably, right? Still a connection with a person. So, all right, very, very cool.

Charlie (01:14:29.88)
Yeah.

Charlie (01:14:41.358)
Yeah, I agree sharing makes it special, doesn’t it?

Jason Elkins (01:14:47.757)
Yeah. Charlie, we’re going to have a link right to your website in the show notes. So anybody that’s listening to this, it’s interested in, you know, the Alps or just maybe doing some business. Maybe you’re a tour operator travel agent in the U S or something like that. Want to reach out and, and partner with Charlie and his team to do something for your clients or.

Charlie (01:14:59.861)
Web.

Jason Elkins (01:15:10.573)
or just whatever the please click on the click on the link and when you and when you get in touch with them, please say I heard Charlie on Jason’s podcast and I’m really excited about, whatever it is. So Charlie, thank you so much. I appreciate you joining us.

Charlie (01:15:24.034)
Yeah, pleasure. Thanks for having me, Jason.

Jason Elkins (01:15:26.903)
again soon. Alright, bye bye.

Return to Top of Page

all episodes
all episodes

Follow 205+ Leaders and the Stories That Shape the Adventure Travel World on the Big World Made Small Podcast

Access the stories here, or on your favorite platform; wherever you prefer.

Get Expert Interviews Delivered Directly to Your Inbox

Join the Big World Made Small Adventure Travel Podcast community and we’ll send you new podcast episodes weekly, and make sure you hear about exclusive and relevant opportunities that you won’t find elsewhere.