Episode #150: Jerry Elkins
Host’s Father & Adventurer
Guest Bio
Jerry Elkins is a lifelong adventurer whose journey has spanned skies, caves, coastlines, and countless open roads. He began flying hot air balloons in 1979 and, for nearly a decade, made his living as a traveling balloon barnstormer — eventually becoming the first pilot to fly in all 50 U.S. states. But Jerry’s adventures go far beyond the basket. Over the past four decades, he’s explored underwater worlds through SCUBA diving, delved into deep caves, traveled extensively, and built lasting connections through storytelling. As the second of four generations of Elkins balloon pilots, Jerry brings a rich legacy of curiosity, courage, and a deep love for the outdoors to every experience he shares.
Show Summary
In this episode of the Big World Made Small Adventure Travel Podcast, host Jason Elkins speaks with his father, Jerry, about a life defined by exploration, personal growth, and family legacy. From early days in Wyoming to adventures across land, air, and sea, their conversation paints a vivid picture of what it means to live fully and intentionally.
They reflect on memorable childhood moments, the power of storytelling, and how a spirit of curiosity led Jerry into ballooning, cave exploration, SCUBA diving, and beyond. With heartfelt honesty, Jerry shares lessons learned from a lifetime of adventure — and Jason explores how those moments have shaped his own path. Together, they celebrate the value of memories, connection, and embracing the unknown.
Key Takeaways
- ✓ Adventure is about personal growth, not just thrills.
- ✓ Childhood experiences often shape our worldview and identity.
- ✓ Embracing discomfort can lead to meaningful transformation.
- ✓ Strong communities and friendships enrich the journey of life.
- ✓ Life’s most treasured possessions are often memories, not things.
- ✓ Writing offers a powerful way to preserve and reflect on experiences.
- ✓ Staying present opens the door to unexpected discoveries.
- ✓ The path of life is a continuous cycle of learning and adapting.
- ✓ Parental support can inspire a lifelong spirit of exploration.
- ✓ It’s never too late to pursue new creative passions.
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Podcast Transcript
This transcript is auto-generated on recording, and has not been edited by a human. It may contain lots of mistakes, crazy words, and stuff that makes no sense. The host and the guest are not responsible for the accuracy of the transcript.
Jason Elkins (00:01.076)
Welcome back everybody to another episode of the big world made small podcast for the adventure traveler doing something totally different today. Still in the realm of adventure, but today I’m well, let me back up. Let’s let’s say this. I’ve interviewed a lot of tour operators, a lot of journalists, a lot of people that are really directly involved in working in adventure tourism. Well, my guest today doesn’t quite fit that mold, but even better. It’s my father.
So I’m interviewing Jerry Elkins, my father, for the Big World Made Small podcast for the adventure traveler. Super excited. So dad, happy to have you here.
Jerry Elkins (00:39.746)
Well, thank you very much, son. It’s quite a unique pleasure because in a lot of ways we share a lot of common ground.
Jason Elkins (00:50.178)
Yeah, absolutely. And I remember you were one of the first people to write a review for the podcast way back. So well, way back about a year and a half ago or so. And, ever since then, I thought, you know, I really need to get dad on here at some point to have a conversation and, discuss some of the cool adventures that we shared together as I was growing up. And, I know you had some adventures before I came along. So I want to capture some of those on recording so we can share it with other family members as well. And, and as well as
My great listeners here on the show. So thanks for agreeing to do this. It’s going to be fun. I have no plan. I, know, before I hit the record button, I told you it’s just a conversation. We’re just going to do that. So, but you know, there’s some things that I know kind of shaped me again that happened while I was growing up, but also before I was ever born. And I remember some of the stories that you and your parents would share about kind of your childhood. And I thought we’d actually start there.
Jerry Elkins (01:23.476)
It’ll be fun. Yeah.
Jerry Elkins (01:30.766)
you
Jason Elkins (01:48.052)
So I don’t know how far back you want to go. And I guess the thing that always intrigued me was just you had a unique kind of unique childhood. You had a pet bobcat in the house that I thought that was pretty cool. we’re going to start with where did you grow up dad?
Jerry Elkins (02:07.202)
I grew up physically. I grew up in Sheridan, Wyoming. I was born there and that was my home residence for a very long time. And it was a good place. It offered a lot of opportunity for adventure and camping and the mountains and the outdoors. So I think that environment
help foster the idea of adventure. So, and I’ve spent a lot of time thinking about adventure and you of course think about it a lot. You’ve been in the adventure business for quite a while from Orvis and Bloening and Claire to where you’re at. And all of your people that you interview are adventure providers.
And the whole concept of adventure, I think, is taken kind of shallow by a lot of people. like, let’s go have an adventure. But adventure is, think, deeper than that. It is what takes you from your comfort view of the world. We all have a view or a window, a filter of the world.
And almost by definition, adventure is when we step outside of that. Sometimes voluntarily and sometimes not voluntarily. But I think by stepping outside of that comfort area into whatever adventure you’re going to undertake is not so much as some people might say, well, it’s an adrenaline rush.
or you know, it’s an excitement. I think actually it’s a growth as you expand your window of comfort and whatever adventure it is, you know, whether it’s a serious physical one or a mind expanding adventure through the jungle or whatever, each of those adventures
Jerry Elkins (04:25.463)
has a way of changing you a little bit. And it seems…
Jason Elkins (04:30.742)
You know, as I, I was just going to say, as I listened to you, dad, I’m, know, if someone were to go back and listen to all the episodes, they would hear that same voice and that same, cause we talk about, you know, adventure is on what’s on the other side of your comfort zone or growth is what’s on the other side of your comfort zone. And whether that’s eating a scorpion on the streets in Thailand or climbing a mountain or just any number of things. So.
Jerry Elkins (04:48.876)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (05:00.354)
Yeah, that really resonates. And I know there’s a connection here. remember growing up, probably the most common phrase or the phrase that stuck with me was another typical Elkins adventure. You’ve heard that a few times.
Jerry Elkins (05:15.873)
Yeah, that was dubbed on me by a good friend of mine, Jerry Mark, came up with that after many adventures we had. But yeah, my adventures were not as well scripted as probably your adventure travel hosts like their adventures to be. Ours were kind of ragtag and it’s like, well let’s…
Let’s go rappel off a steamboat rock or, you know, let’s do a winter ski trip down the Bighorns through the Littlehorn Canyon or, you know, they they were kind of like, yeah, let’s go do it and see if we can survive. So, yeah, it’s always good to survive another Elkins adventure. And you have been having years of Elkins adventure. So. Yeah.
Jason Elkins (06:08.034)
There were times that I remember as a child thinking, I’m not sure like this is normal. I don’t think we should be here. I’m sure my mom felt that way. We could touch on that or not. I’m not sure if we want to go there. She might listen to this. But it’s, just, have so many memories of just doing these things that definitely felt unscripted. That’s a, that’s a really good term for it.
sometimes wondering if we would survive it, but we always did. And I think that that’s part of who I am now. We did those things and one thing I remember is we took a trip to Mexico. I think you kind of loaded us all in the van and you had the big utility trailer. So we and some friends of yours and some other kids.
Probably rode half the way in the trailer. don’t remember if he let us ride in the trailer or not, but I remember thinking we did. Maybe we shouldn’t discuss that, but.
Jerry Elkins (07:08.973)
Well, we did not let you kids ride in the trailer. We had the van and you could all sleep in it. There was very little traveling in the trailer. I did some. I think Don did some. But yeah, yeah, it was a weekend trip. We went down to Six Flags over Texas for the weekend. like a thousand miles, left Thursday night, drove all the way there.
Jason Elkins (07:13.963)
Okay.
Jason Elkins (07:28.802)
Mm-hmm.
Jerry Elkins (07:37.089)
did big adventures and yeah.
Jason Elkins (07:39.906)
Well, that was, that was one of the trips, but I remember we also went more to California. So it was the Disneyland and then we crossed into Mexico. And what I remember there’s those trips, then the summers, know, my brother, Justin, my brother and I, you know, you know, the guy, you know, would spend our summers with you. And I remember we’d come back to school and usually.
Jerry Elkins (07:46.219)
Yeah?
Yep.
Jerry Elkins (07:57.687)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (08:04.46)
that first day back at school and you know, first grade, second grade, third grade or whatever it was. And the teacher was like, well tell the class what you did this summer. And everybody would take turns. And, I would just say some things that just sounded completely random. And I believe that at one point the teacher called mom and said, you know, your kid’s great. He’s, you know, super smart kid, da da da da da, but he, but he has a little problem with honesty. She’s like, well, what do you mean?
Well, he came back and he said he was, you know, don’t know, rappelling off of cliffs or going caving or, you know, going to Mexico for the weekend and all this. And she was just absolutely convinced that I was making that stuff up. And I think when I was able to understand that story, I realized, geez, maybe my childhood was a little different than some of the other kids.
Jerry Elkins (08:54.988)
It was, it was a complex situation because there wasn’t a lot of stability in my summers. The way my life was going, it’s like, well, I want to take you guys with me and do the things I do. And it sort of preempted you from, you know, high school. Well,
grade school sports and you know your friends through the summer it kind of pulled you out of a normal life, more normal life that you lived with your mother and threw you into like two and a half months of like you say gosh I wonder if we’re gonna live through this.
Jason Elkins (09:35.938)
When you said two and a half months, the first word that popped in my head was chaos, but I’m not sure, like, but in a good way, you know, it might’ve been a little bit chaotic. Maybe spontaneous is a much better word. Um, or adventurous is obviously, you know, a good word.
Jerry Elkins (09:52.717)
So do you remember the day we went to Billy Creek Cave up in the Bighorns above Buffalo?
Jason Elkins (10:00.615)
I do and that’s we repelled down into the cave that cave.
Jerry Elkins (10:03.948)
Yeah, yeah, there was a log across the pit entrance and I rappelled you down one side and Justin down the other side so that the rope remained hanging over the log. And then I hooked into it and did a double line rappel down. And we explored, the first time I’d ever been in there, it was an interesting cave. It was kind of, you know, like a maze.
I was thinking, okay, well, do we go here or do we go there? And we wandered around in it for quite a while and saw a lot of pretty things. But when it came time to get out, my idea was, you I’d sort of belay you up, sort of lift you up. There was no way to really free climb it because it was a dome-shaped bowl that we repelled down into.
Jason Elkins (10:33.058)
Mm-hmm.
Jerry Elkins (10:55.948)
But I got out and I was able to pull Justin out pretty easily, but I couldn’t pull you out. So, you you’re in the bottom and Justin and are in the top and it’s getting dark and I was like, wow, this one will be interesting.
Jason Elkins (11:03.692)
you
Jason Elkins (11:16.396)
I don’t remember feeling like, well, you probably weren’t sharing with me. Jason, I’m not sure how I’m gonna get you out.
Jerry Elkins (11:22.472)
No, no, I tried not to do that. Speaking of that though, you know, flying in Williamsport when we flew over that mountain and got into a little situation with the cloud bank and a rapid descent down over the mountain, as one of the few times I’ve actually told people, was like, I think we’re in big trouble. Normally I don’t do that.
Jason Elkins (11:48.236)
I do remember that. And I think for our listeners at this point, it’d be good to, it will give them kind of an idea. Cause we’re talking about a bunch of different things and we did a bunch of different things. It’s hard to kind of summarize it at all, but maybe I’ll share kind of my perspective of what I thought happened. And then you can jump in and correct me where I’m or I’m mistaken. But obviously, you know, you, you and mom, work together forever. You were together when we, you know, when we were young.
and we’re doing some of those activities and would, would take us as young kids to go do those things. have a few memories of that. And then we’d spend some summers with you and then you were working as a CPA or a, guess what you were the CFO for a mining company. Is that right? Or, or not a CFO, but you tell the story. What I remember is you were working and then you convinced the state of Wyoming to do a special project.
Actually, we need to start a little bit before that. You were working, you and your buddies heard about ballooning. And so let’s start there. You’re working, you’ve got two young kids.
Jerry Elkins (12:59.966)
Okay, we’ll roll back to the real world, or the world that I escaped from.
Jason Elkins (13:05.428)
Okay.
Jerry Elkins (13:11.198)
Yeah, I did get a degree in accounting. I was a CPA. And I worked as a CPA for a number of years. In fact, that was probably a big first adventure for you guys. Your mother and I took you guys to Alaska. We drove up the Alcan in November. Temperatures, we saw temperatures 70 below zero in Tocque Junction. You were two and Justin was one.
So I went up there for an accounting job, a CPA job, and we didn’t stay there. We came back and then I worked for some local CPAs in Sheridan, Wyoming. And then I got a job with NERCO, which was a mining holding company, a subsidiary of Pacific Power and Light.
And then the balloon idea come along some friends of mine that we did adventures we decided to get a hot air balloon. None of us knew how to fly it of course and eight of us went together and purchased this hot air balloon and started learning to fly. And that was right around the time that your mother and I got divorced.
Imagine that, but anyway. yeah, so anyway, that was, and at the time I was doing a lot of caving. I was a pretty serious cave explorer. The hot air ballooning was just another adventure that opened another window into my life that ended up being a large enough window to escape through. So I left.
Jason Elkins (14:32.194)
It’s true that had no influence on it whatsoever.
Jerry Elkins (14:56.411)
that life of being an accountant and became a balloon barnstormer and Traveled around the country barnstorming balloons or going from place to place and selling rides So that was probably in fact you and Justin were my first Passengers when I got my license in the balloon which Was another good adventure. I’m sure you remember that one
Jason Elkins (15:22.114)
I do remember that.
Jerry Elkins (15:26.203)
an eye-opener. Well, yeah, so that was the transitional period from going to having a home in Sheridan and having you guys in the summer to quitting my job in Sheridan and basically living in the front of a truck with a dog and you two during the summer. So I’m sure you remember many, many miles.
the four of us in the front of a truck.
Jason Elkins (15:57.186)
four of us that I specifically remember a trip, we were just leaving Sheridan to head back east to go do some balloon festivals and, and, about 30 miles, you know, this was probably a, I don’t know, 1200 mile trip and about 30 miles after it started, uh, you picked up a hitchhiker. Cause you thought you might need some help driving and Justin and I were too young to help drive. So we picked up the hitchhiker and.
Jerry Elkins (16:15.23)
Yeah.
Jerry Elkins (16:22.527)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (16:24.52)
He was just kind of open ended about he’s like, wherever, wherever you’re going, I’ll go with you. And I think he went all the way to Pennsylvania with us and.
Jerry Elkins (16:32.107)
Now I think we were probably in Minnesota. Big rainstorm and we were all in the front of the truck. The dog. No, this is a single bench. Yeah, so and we’d been that way for the better part of a day because the weather was really pretty bad and we finally came to a big overpass.
Jason Elkins (16:42.626)
And this wasn’t a crew cap pickup. This was just a standard pickup.
Jerry Elkins (16:57.899)
where the rain, you know, you get out of the rain. And he said, you know, I think I’d like out here. And I couldn’t blame him, but yeah, he got out in the middle of a rainstorm under an overpass and we continued our trip. But yeah, he rode with us for quite a bit of that distance. So.
Jason Elkins (17:04.066)
Yeah
Jason Elkins (17:18.322)
Well, a lot of fun. You meant when you mentioned, you know, quit your job, sell your stuff, living in the front of a pickup. It’s hard for that not to resonate for me because many of the listeners know and you know that I kind of quit the job, sold my stuff and now I live in an Airbnb, different Airbnb every week and everything I own is in my suitcase. So I wonder how I might’ve been influenced to go that direction.
Jerry Elkins (17:43.552)
Yeah, well, and you’re doing that adventurously. It’s not like you’re living in Chicago, you know, just hanging out there. You have the adventure of travel. Your window to the world around you grows all the time. And, you know, I assume…
Well, I can tell by the way you live, you’ve come to that divide also. You either have material things or you have adventure. It’s really hard to have both because your material things start locking in your view of the world. They hold you back.
Jason Elkins (18:28.535)
Hmm.
Jerry Elkins (18:39.785)
the adventure pulls you away from those things. And it’s more about the experience of growing through the different adventures than it is about accumulating. And I say that after now I’ve been at this ranch here for 30 years and I’ve accumulated a lot because you have to have it because you can’t go to the store.
And I’m in the process of getting rid of everything, which reminds me I have several barrels of things that are yours. When you say you live out of a suitcase, you know I’m
Jason Elkins (19:14.218)
I knew you’d slide that into the conversation. And I’m pretty sure last time we discussed this, said, dad, it’s not really mine anymore. It’s not mine anymore. Please don’t burden me with that. I remember stories, somebody, I don’t know who it was, but somebody said that.
Jerry Elkins (19:22.357)
Yeah, just like get rid of it. I don’t want it.
Jerry Elkins (19:28.351)
Ha ha.
Jason Elkins (19:36.192)
She was, think maybe high school, something like that. And her dad traveled a lot and every time he’d go someplace, he’d like bring her a rock. So she had all these rocks that her dad had picked up along the way and brought her. I thought, there’s something to that. It’s like, what are you trying to tell your kid when you, you know, you’re out traveling, you bring them back rocks.
Jerry Elkins (19:47.859)
you
Jerry Elkins (20:03.766)
Ha
Jason Elkins (20:03.82)
that they’re going to feel like they can never get rid of because my dad gave me this rock. So are you going to carry around this rock? What’s the, what’s the motive behind giving your kid rocks? You know, no judgment, but it was, I just remember thinking, you know, I’ve got some things or I had some things that I accumulated over the years and it was hard to let go of it.
Jerry Elkins (20:09.108)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (20:26.186)
So a big box of rocks is a really good example of like, how do I get rid of this? My dad gave it to me. What if something happens to him and he’s no longer around and I can’t get rid of the rocks. don’t know. I think a lot of people feel based that they have too many things that makes it hard to move or downsize or whatever. And I’d heard someone say, you know, it’s not the things that were attached to it’s the memories that they create or, know, when we see them.
Jerry Elkins (20:35.74)
They’re just rocks.
Jerry Elkins (20:53.288)
Yes.
Jason Elkins (20:55.682)
And yeah, well, and that was this guy’s. Yeah, that’s what this guy’s angle was like. We all have cell phones now. We can probably have as many camp, many pictures as we want our cell phones. So take those things, take a picture of them and then get rid of them, you know, give them away or whatever. Cause cause it’s not the thing. It’s the memory that’s associated with that’s easy to say. I get that, you know, for some people that’s not so easy to actually do.
Jerry Elkins (20:55.774)
while they’re in a sense are like a photograph. And photographs are lot easier to pack around.
Jason Elkins (21:25.314)
Fortunately, I got to the point where I was able to do it because it’s just so much easier to live in Airbnb is when you’re not carrying around a box of rocks. anyway.
Jerry Elkins (21:35.827)
Yeah, yeah. Well, my dad, two of the things that he left me, which I can’t get rid of yet. I’m looking forward to the day, but it’s a post hole auger and a digging bar. I spent so much of my childhood watching him use them and helping what a bit of a little guy can do.
Jason Elkins (21:51.554)
cheese
Jerry Elkins (22:03.582)
but then I inherited them and dug 500 fence posts, you know? So it’s like, they’re great, I love them, and I am tired of digging fence post holes, you know. I was kinda hoping I could pass them on to you, but I don’t know.
Jason Elkins (22:20.45)
I’m not digging any fence posts for a long time, hope. boy. So anyway, let’s go back. you’re doing the ballooning barnstorming thing. Justin and I are traveling in the front of the pickup with you. We’ve got the hot air balloon wrapped up in the back of the pickup truck with a couple barrels. That’s kind of our traveling supplies or whatever.
Jerry Elkins (22:43.978)
Trademark. Fill over that, yeah, that’s luggage.
Jason Elkins (22:48.438)
Yep. And to describe the pickup, you know, the one I probably feel the strongest connection with was yellow. I’m sure it was a Ford pickup and you had a big, stock rack. And for those of our listeners, it can’t imagine what that is. imagine a pickup truck driving down the road with a cow in the back of it. So imagine the, maybe the thing that looks like a fence or something around the back of pickup truck to keep the cow from climbing out when they stopped to get gas.
Jerry Elkins (23:00.959)
Yeah.
Jerry Elkins (23:17.288)
Yep, cattle rack.
Jason Elkins (23:17.782)
That’s a stock rack, cattle rack, yep. And so we spent our summers traveling that way when the weather was nice. Again, this is something we do anymore, but when the weather was nice, Justin and I would be out in the back of the truck, you know, just enjoying the wind or sleeping on top of the balloon or whatever with the stock rack around it. So we weren’t going to fall out, but and the dog.
Jerry Elkins (23:37.555)
and the dog.
And if it got really, really harsh, that dog got to come up front.
Jason Elkins (23:44.448)
Yep. And yeah, exactly. There were times we’d be at an event and there were just a few more, you know, more people in the vehicle or whatever. And it was, there was limited space. And I remember a few times that, well, the dog needs to come up front because she’s cold and, and you guys can put on a coat. We can bundle you up. She can’t. we’re dog ride up front.
Jerry Elkins (24:07.389)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (24:12.642)
I’m not saying that she shouldn’t have been able to ride a front, it was just, it was just one of those memories. Um, yeah. And then of course we’d come home every summer after every summer and tell mom about the hours we spent in the back of the pickup, cruising down the freeway or the, uh, the balloon rides. one of the things I remember, we go to the festival and you know, you were kind of
Jerry Elkins (24:15.121)
Yeah, yeah, it’s an adjustment. Yeah, it’s like, what’s his priority?
Jason Elkins (24:41.43)
financing all this by selling rides, where sometimes you had sponsors that you were, you know, needed to fly at these festivals. So it wasn’t always that Justin and I were able to be in the balloon every time. We did a lot, but it wasn’t always a given. But I remember sometimes, you’re probably like, I don’t think we need to air this, Jason, later on after we have this conversation. But anyway, I remember sometimes.
Jerry Elkins (25:05.235)
Yeah, we can edit it, yeah.
Jason Elkins (25:07.66)
that it was like, well, it’s a little too windy to take paying passengers, a little too windy to take the sponsors, but the skillset, you had the skillset to have the flight. And I believe what you always told me is you wanted me to learn how to manage windy landings. You know, especially when I started learning to fly, but I just remember quite a few times it’s like, well, now I think it’s too windy. And then you turn a look at me and say, Jason, get in the basket.
That’s the way I remember it. don’t know. Maybe it only happened once, but it left a mark.
Jerry Elkins (25:35.539)
True story.
Jerry Elkins (25:40.33)
As one of my philosophies as a balloon pilot and perhaps as anything else I do is you want to know where your limits are because you don’t want to go beyond your limit but if you don’t know where it is you maybe could go a lot farther than you’re going and not be at your limit.
But when you are flying a balloon, there is a lot of responsibility and you don’t have control over the weather.
And forecasts back then, mean, forecasts now are pretty incredible, but 30 years ago, they weren’t quite so good. And so it’s like you, you can’t learn to do a windy landing if you’re not flying in the wind. You know, you can think about it and you can figure out what you would do, but you can’t practice it without the wind. So you can’t take new people, people that are
you know don’t know what they’re getting into they’re not familiar with it I would always make the determination that yeah I think this is doable we’re gonna be fine but you got to do it to learn so as you started learning and also a balloon needs to be weighted properly you know this you’re a very good balloon pilot you know if you’re flying too light
Jason Elkins (26:59.116)
Mm-hmm.
Jerry Elkins (27:11.495)
It doesn’t control the same. You lose a margin of control because your envelope can fold a little and you lose more heat and then it changes your equilibrium. So you want it loaded properly when you’re flying in less than ideal conditions, but you can’t load it with the newbies. Your son’s sure.
Jason Elkins (27:36.95)
Yeah.
You know, and what’s, what’s the worst that’s going to happen if we get scratched or bruised? You know, we might complain a little bit, but tell our mom about it, but you know.
Jerry Elkins (27:40.157)
But you both…
Jerry Elkins (27:49.906)
yeah, but I mean, it’s that adventure. It expanded your view of the world that you live in. You you and Justin both became incredibly good pilots, in my opinion. And it’s because you were exposed to a lot and you grew to embrace it.
Jason Elkins (28:13.986)
there is in the ballooning, also, you know, obviously in life as well, because that’s where these things go is.
You know, I met a pilot at a balloon festival that, you knew, can’t think of his name off the of my head right now. And I know I’ve shared this with you before, but he was talking about one of the things about ballooning is, know, when you launch a balloon, you generally don’t know where you’re going to land. It’s one of the few kind of, if you want to call it a trans, I don’t like to call it, it’s not really a transportation tool, but if you think of airplanes, helicopters, cars, horses, whatever things you might get on to go someplace.
Jerry Elkins (28:52.969)
You have a destination in mind.
Jason Elkins (28:55.254)
You, yeah, you have a destination in mind. You’re going to another airport. You’re going somewhere specifically where with the balloon it’s you launch, you know, you’re going downwind generally, but there’s different wind layers going different directions. So you don’t necessarily have a destination. So you take this 80, you know, 80 feet, eight story tall balloon on a basket and you put some passengers in it that
Maybe paying passengers, they may be your crew friends, whatever, but they don’t fly balloons. They’re not gonna take over the controls, no matter how many times they might’ve seen a movie or whatever, you know, there’s things out there, but they get in and you take off responsible for them and legitimately can’t say where you’re going. And it’s that ability. And what he was sharing was he’s like, I don’t know where I’m gonna land, but I have ability.
Jerry Elkins (29:43.889)
Well…
Jason Elkins (29:51.466)
Or I have faith in my ability to figure it out along the way. That was a big thing. Faith in your ability to figure it out along the way obviously applies to ballooning, but my gosh, doesn’t that apply to so many things in life? There’s so many things that people will not launch because they need to know where they’re going before they take off. And if you can launch a project, launch your decision, launch a relationship, launch whatever it is.
and have faith in your ability to figure it out along the way, you’re much more likely to launch. And I think that’s been the lesson I learned.
Jerry Elkins (30:24.104)
and realize that you’re going to have to make a lot of decisions and not all of them will be good. And when you make a bad one, you need to change it. And yeah, you develop a faith in yourself that you can do things, but you have to do the things to get the faith. And in the process of doing the things, some of them don’t work out quite as well as you’d have liked, but…
Jason Elkins (30:27.746)
Mm-hmm.
Jason Elkins (30:33.186)
Hmm?
Jason Elkins (30:47.372)
Right.
Jerry Elkins (30:53.446)
Yeah, I made it a long time.
Jason Elkins (30:54.594)
So we can use that metaphor.
Yeah. Well that, well, we talk about, you know, getting in the balloon when the conditions are not dangerous, but less than ideal or, know, challenging, they’re going to push the envelope a little bit, literally for those that didn’t get the pun, the envelope of the balloon. But it’s, but being able to climb in the basket. Well, let me back up having a parent.
Jerry Elkins (30:59.56)
How about luck out through that?
Jerry Elkins (31:15.27)
Yeah, fold the envelope sometimes.
Jason Elkins (31:27.178)
or a mentor encourage you to climb into the basket, knowing that you’re going to be pushed. You know, the limits are going to be pushed a little bit and that you’re going to be put outside your comfort zone. And then you survive it. Hopefully you survive it. it teaches that message that, my gosh, I can get outside my comfort zone and survive it. And probably have a pretty cool experience.
Jerry Elkins (31:43.878)
Yeah, so.
Jerry Elkins (31:55.74)
Well, and learn from it. How old were you when you soloed?
Jason Elkins (32:00.415)
14? Yeah. Yep.
Jerry Elkins (32:01.353)
14 I think Yeah, and I remember you Many years after that and Jordan your daughter comes along and you go dad. How could you? Let me go by myself in a balloon at 14 when
my daughter wants to drive a car around the block and she’s 16 and it scares me. You know? And that’s, yeah, yeah, I remember that. it’s like, because I had faith. Because you had the experiences, you had gotten in the balloon, you had an expanded knowledge of how to work it.
Jason Elkins (32:28.034)
Yeah, I remember saying that.
Jason Elkins (32:35.808)
Hmm?
Jerry Elkins (32:51.418)
And the conditions were good and the instructions were precise, you know, you’re not going to take off for hours on end, you know, but yeah, it’s… And parenting is a difficult thing, as you know. What do you teach? How do you teach it? Full well realizing that you’re really not teaching, that you’re…
maybe providing the opportunity to learn. And then I say, well, what do want them to learn? And I’m pretty proud of the fact that you guys have learned to live. Not to be afraid of living and not to be…
in the rut or seeking material gain above the experience of life. I think I’m I think you guys did pretty good and I don’t I don’t take credit for it. mean your mother had an awful lot to do with it. I did provide a lot of adventure which changed your window of the world but you’re the
Jason Elkins (34:04.386)
Mm-hmm.
Jason Elkins (34:08.469)
And that’s, yeah, I appreciate that. that’s, you know, because I have interesting people on the show that are doing interesting things. Many, a lot of similarities. A lot of them have parents that…
encouraged them to take risks and to take chances and to, you know, go out and quite a few of them traveled to other countries alone when they were younger, you know, for some sort of exchange program, or they were exposed to these things that a lot of parents have a real hard time with, you know, that, that really aren’t going to encourage their kids to do that. I’ve got many of the guests on the show, you know, went to school, got a degree and then became a,
a ski instructor, you know, with their, their degree or they, they became a guide, an overland guide in Africa, or they, they went away, you know, to explore the world. And that’s all super, super cool. And it’s because their parents instilled something to, to, to ways either they instilled the confidence and the desire to go explore and push their boundaries. Or they were so
domineering and controlling that the kid that the person just said, screw this, I’m out of here. There’s a few of both, but anyway, I appreciate that you, you took the first approach of encouraging us to, to go out there, push our boundaries and be exposed to those things. So that’s a, it’s very cool. When you, so when that part of the barnstorming ballooning ended, you you still did some ballooning stuff. It’s, it’s been a part of your life.
Jerry Elkins (35:31.016)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (35:55.276)
continuously you still you know I know you’re spending time with my brother flying with him he’s a commercial pilot as well and you’re helping you’ve done some instruction for some of his friends and so you’re still involved in that but I do want to touch on go ahead I was I wanted to touch on kind of that the other part of your life you mentioned the ranch you said I’ve been here for about 30 years now so let’s let’s talk about the ranch because I know that that’s a big part of your life
Jerry Elkins (36:11.151)
No, I’m involved.
Jason Elkins (36:25.466)
And you’re in a transition there around the ranch. So maybe somebody is hearing this things, man, I need to go check that place out. sounds, sounds pretty cool. So tell us about what in the heck made you decide to buy this little piece of property in the middle of North. And then how did you get from that point to where you are now?
Jerry Elkins (36:46.331)
Well, that is interesting.
Jerry Elkins (36:52.487)
It does go back a bit to, you know, do you have things or do you do things? And, you when I grew up, one, I never really wanted to own a piece of land because you’re kind of stuck there, you know, and people are all around you and you’re anchored. So…
I went on the road ballooning, barnstorming, know, just living in the truck. And then of course I fall in love with another woman and we get married and we both are traveling around living in the truck and it’s great. Life is good. And as…
women can be more sensible than men. The idea of the fact that, well, know, someday we’re going to get old, which I never thought I would, so that sounded ridiculous. But anyway, you know, we’re going to need a nest. We’re going to want to be somewhere. We’re going to need a nest. So as we traveled around, we kind of looked for nesting places.
But by then, you know, land values had already skyrocketed in Wyoming and Montana and, you know, Arizona, as beautiful as it is, is hostile ground. You know, it’s not user friendly and New Mexico looked pretty good. But still, it’s, you know, you’re buying a place.
And we by accident actually found this place when you say in the middle of nowhere. It literally is. It is probably the most remote spot in the continental United States. My nearest neighbor. Who was 20 miles away? Isn’t there anymore? No one’s there, so my nearest neighbor now is.
Jerry Elkins (38:55.975)
probably 50 miles away. it’s, every day is just…
an adventure seeing the world the way the world is without people in it. And it changes your pace. It allows you to think. Of course we’ve got internet and I could go online and check all kinds of things, but I haven’t had a television. I haven’t been on Facebook for 15 years probably.
to quit all that. There was a brief time, yeah, there was a brief time and just before my divorce from my second wife, I was like, I don’t want anything of this, you know, I just, it, it pollutes what I consider a pristine, nice world.
Jason Elkins (39:35.554)
I didn’t think you ever were on Facebook. I’m surprised to hear that you ever, yeah.
Jerry Elkins (39:58.041)
in my mind. just don’t have time for my mind to go there when my mind can be watching the animals. And of course there’s a lot of construction involved if you live off the grid in the middle of nowhere. So…
I used to, a long time ago, I was a carpenter’s apprentice and spent a whole summer working really hard with a carpenter building a house and learned and realized I didn’t want to ever do that again. So I’ve spent the last 30 years doing exactly that because if you want to live in a house in the middle of nowhere, you have to build it.
because you know other than friends and family I’ve had a lot of friends and family a lot come and help me do a lot of the stuff but you don’t but you don’t hire a carpenter and you don’t hire a plumber and you don’t hire an electrician.
to come to the middle of nowhere because if they’re any good, they aren’t gonna do that. They’re working somewhere else with the exception of my friends. I have a friend who is a licensed electrician. I have one that’s a plumber. I have one that does concrete. So all the things you need to have done, I had friends come help me do and learn it. But yeah, so I’ve spent a long period of time building what I think is an incredible place.
I would never leave if I figured I was going to live forever, you know, but I know I’m not and I’m going to have to leave someday at some point. And so, you I made the decision a couple of years ago that I’ve loved it and it’s like blooming. I’ve been flying. I’ve flown for 50 years, but things change.
Jerry Elkins (41:49.951)
and you need a transition, you transition out. So I’m in the transition from the ranch to writing. I want to write, which is kind of strange because I hardly ever read. But I’ve
Jason Elkins (42:07.298)
I’m a little surprised to hear you say that. I think this is the first time I’ve ever heard you say you want to write. I do remember you reading though.
Jerry Elkins (42:12.548)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I’ve got an idea for a science fiction book, which is really bizarre in my mind because I’d never read science fiction. I don’t have anything against it, I, you know, wasn’t, wasn’t my thing and other people’s stories wasn’t my thing, but, so I want to write this book just because I want the challenge of trying to figure out how
Jason Elkins (42:20.29)
Yeah?
Jerry Elkins (42:40.186)
you pull something together, how you create characters out of the air that work and go and do stuff. So it’s like, okay, I can keep myself mentally satisfied doing that. So I think that’s a big transition. If I quit doing what I’m doing, I got to fill it with something else. So I think they’ll be good.
Jason Elkins (42:59.638)
right, cool.
Jason Elkins (43:06.082)
Well, when you, when you publish the book, we’ll come back and we’ll just discuss the book. Cause I’m fascinated by that. I, this is the first time I’ve heard of this. So we need to, we need to chat more. Um, one of the things you touched on though, one of the things you.
Jerry Elkins (43:16.358)
Yeah, am writing a diary autobiography and I actually have made big progress on that. a couple hundred pages into it.
Jason Elkins (43:24.61)
Oh, wow. All right. That’s pretty cool. I’m looking forward to learning more about that. That’s kind of a big surprise. Hey, one of the things that you touched on was being out in the middle of nowhere, building a place in the middle of nowhere. How do you get carpenters and this, that, but you’ve got, or plumbers, but you’ve got friends that have pitched in. So something that’s always been interesting to me is
that you are one of the most social people I know in many ways. As far as when I was growing up, every town we went to, you had a friend, a group of friends, either people you already knew or you made friends instantly. You showed up, there were 20, 30, 40 people that just seemed to wanna hang around all the time. And I just recall those days as you having tons of friends everywhere. And I
You still do. mean, most of those friendships were not just we’re in town this weekend. These are friendships that continued. And then many of them came out to the land and helped you build the house and did different projects or just, or just spent time there. You know, I remember people who take their vacation time, go to your place and help you build the house or dig a root cellar or whatever. And it’s just always been fascinating because
When I tell people my dad lives in the middle of nowhere, he’s 150 miles or whatever from the nearest stoplight. Immediately I, in my head, think that they 180 miles. Yeah. In my head or based on some of their responses, they’re like, Oh, he sounds like a real hermit. He sounds like is the, um, you know, all these different words and names you might use to describe someone that wants to get as far away from people as humanly possible.
Jerry Elkins (44:57.178)
Yeah, 180.
Jason Elkins (45:15.926)
And then I’m like, no, he’s one of the most outgoing people I know. He has more friends than I can imagine. how do you, where do you think that came from? mean, what are your thoughts? I don’t know. just have always thought it was interesting and I’ve never really asked you about it. So.
Jerry Elkins (45:32.122)
Well, I do like friends and I’m blessed to have a lot of friends and traveling around the country, they’re all spread out. And interestingly, I do believe that if any of them, if we live next door to each other in probably six months or a year or two years or three years, we wouldn’t even talk to each other.
Jason Elkins (46:00.456)
OK.
Jerry Elkins (46:01.478)
You know, but we share a lot of common traits. All of my friends are wonderful people. They’re honest to a T. They got the biggest hearts of anybody I know. And when we see each other. We enjoy the good in each other. And we don’t have to be around each other when.
Things aren’t so good, you know. was like, God damn, Elkins didn’t mow his yard again. What’s wrong with him? He doesn’t like to shovel the snow, you know. So it’s easy, it’s easier to have close friends at a distance, I think, than to have them next door.
So I think that explains a lot why we’re still tight. my friends from as long, far back as I can remember, are still my friends. And we see each other when we can. But as far as the other eight billion people living on the planet,
I don’t feel compelled to be around them. It’s not that I dislike them. They’re not bringing value into my life as much as the sun sets here. Misty and I sit on the swing on the front porch and watch the sunset and the wild horses come in. It’s salve for the soul to…
Jason Elkins (47:13.538)
Okay.
Jerry Elkins (47:39.494)
be in this kind of an environment. It’s just incredible. you know, when we go out to our cowboy hot tub and float in the hot water and look at the stars, we feel like we’re the luckiest people on the planet.
because we’re seeing there’s absolutely zero light pollution where we live, none. There’s not a radio tower. There is not a neighbor’s house that can see in the mountain 20 miles away. There’s nothing. So the night skies are just like you just, they’re a treat and we get them every night. So it’s just wonderful.
So I go to a city and I am becoming more reclusive. I go to a town and like you mentioned that you’re still feeling a little bit like an outsider and you’re…
Jason Elkins (48:18.164)
It is a
Jerry Elkins (48:28.897)
new location. I like, I’ve lived here for 30 years. I go to Eureka, where my post office box is, 70 miles away, and I feel like an outsider. It’s like a town that’s got 400 people in it. I’ve lived here 30 years and I bet I don’t know five of them, you know. It’s, and that’s okay. They don’t need me and I’m fine, so that’s interesting.
Jason Elkins (48:57.546)
It’s a very unique place. I, as you’ve reminded me on occasion, I don’t visit enough and I agree. And, but when I have been there, it is just like you describe. mean, you can see the sky. Like I’ve been fortunate to visit a lot of places and just to be at your place and to look up and see the sky and that much detail and just.
look out across the valley and just it’s so peaceful. It and honestly maybe for me it’s almost even too peaceful to be honest with you. I mean it’s a
Jerry Elkins (49:34.981)
Yeah, I think that’s common for lot of people. They aren’t comfortable with, we’ll call it isolation. I don’t feel isolated at all, but they want more background activity.
Jason Elkins (49:54.464)
Yeah, yep. And I think that’s even more common now with all of the quick access to dopamine and the cell phones and the social media. And I’m not gonna lie, I know I get sucked into it. I can say that I’m all about the experiences and the culture in this. And then I find myself on my phone doom scrolling for two hours and I’m like, my gosh, I’m not.
Jerry Elkins (50:04.615)
yeah.
Jerry Elkins (50:19.375)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (50:19.402)
I got the same thing going on. And so you’ve got all these things going on. And then you go to a place where there’s stuff. I mean, it’s a beautiful place, but you don’t get that type of, mean, you’ve got internet, so I guess you could go sit there and just scroll, but why would you? But it’s, it’s just a bit different. And I like that. I appreciate that, but I’ve got a attention span. I guess I don’t know. So.
Jerry Elkins (50:41.061)
Yeah.
Jerry Elkins (50:44.453)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (50:50.09)
Huh, all right, very cool. So we discussed a bunch of things. There are so many things that I want to continue. I think we should do a whole father son series of podcast episodes because I’ve got so many stories and things that come to mind, but I realized, geez, that would take eight hours to cover all of them. I just really just want to have this conversation, get the conversation started. Maybe we make this a more routine type of thing. But.
Dad, did I, what do I need to ask you? What did I forget to ask you? What are you, what do you want to make sure that, that our listeners, cause I know your friends are going to hear this. I’m as soon as I published this, you’ve got a lot of friends on social media that every time I post anything related to you, Oh my gosh, how’s your dad doing? Da da da da. have it all where I’m going to see him in a month or I met him here. met him there. So when I published this, they’re going to listen to this. So what do you want to make sure he’s saying before we go?
Jerry Elkins (51:43.205)
Well, I’m still vertical. So that’s that’s good. Yeah, well, I now I’m in a great relationship with a high school classmate. We graduated together and a year ago at our 55th class reunion, we reconnected and I don’t know if you know this.
Jason Elkins (51:46.466)
You
Jerry Elkins (52:12.776)
bit of trivia connection, but the Wyoming balloon, when I made the proposal to the state, I had a painting that I took to visually show what I talking about with the bucking horse in the Wyoming and, you know, a beautiful balloon that was painted from the idea before the balloon ever existed. Well, Misty is the artist that painted that.
So and she’s with me now and yeah.
Jason Elkins (52:43.426)
Very cool. I did know that, but I, some of our listeners, some of your friends that might not actually know that backstory. So that’s very cool. And actually we didn’t really touch on the whole connection with Wyoming, you know, born and raised in Wyoming. So was I. you were, yep. And you were able to leave your job as an accountant. My understanding of the story is because you convinced the state of Wyoming to
Jerry Elkins (52:47.65)
Yeah.
Jerry Elkins (52:59.758)
So Justin.
Jason Elkins (53:11.436)
I don’t know all the details. We don’t want to go into that, but you convince them to participate in a project where a balloon would be designed and you would travel around with it to promote tourism to the state of Wyoming. And so that’s the balloon you’re describing when you talk about the painting that Misty Misty did of the balloon, right?
Jerry Elkins (53:26.028)
Yeah, yeah. And there was a lot of misunderstanding there, but basically what it was was a contract for services. I agreed to get a balloon, you know, based on that design that I presented to them. And I would buy it myself. I would get the balloon and they would contract a number of events over a course of three years.
Jason Elkins (53:53.762)
Mm-hmm.
Jerry Elkins (53:54.293)
So they never…
paid me to get a balloon or to travel or to take it anywhere. They never reimbursed any of my expenses. What they did was they contracted for my service with the balloon. So I’d go to various events around the state and some events not in the state, but where they thought it would be lucrative to have the balloon promoted. yeah, but that, I was able to take their agreement to
do these events take that to the bank to get a loan because that showed that I would have revenue to be able to pay the note. yeah I was worked out pretty good and then one day quit my job and never went back.
Jason Elkins (54:37.93)
Mm-hmm. All right.
Jason Elkins (54:48.706)
So that was the balloon that we were traveling with in the back of the pickup truck, sleeping on top of. It was such a fun experience because we’d show up at these festivals and for some reason just something about that balloon, something about probably your personality and just that. I recall you wearing cowboy hats and shaps and stuff like that. I don’t think you wore shaps all the time, but I remember it was…
Jerry Elkins (54:52.995)
Yeah.
Jerry Elkins (54:57.051)
1985. This one will hit the road with it.
Jerry Elkins (55:15.604)
I was Western.
Jason Elkins (55:18.658)
It was kind of, I don’t know, the costume. Your grandkids still think of you as a cowboy. I do as well. And I know you’re a lot of your friends do. But it was fun to show up at a balloon festival, maybe in upstate New York with Wyoming balloon at the big bucking horse on the side of it. And the pilot that, you know, looked like he was right out of the old Western movies or whatever, flying the balloon. And it was, it was just a lot of fun. So it was, yeah. Yeah. It was a lot of fun. So.
Jerry Elkins (55:33.784)
Yeah. Yeah.
Jason Elkins (55:49.026)
All right.
Jerry Elkins (55:49.548)
And I think that’s important to have good memories to look back on because man, the older you get, all that you have left are your memories. And that provided a lot of good ones. yeah.
Jason Elkins (55:56.833)
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah. Well, it was fun to have this conversation because it brought up a lot of, a lot of good memories and there’s so many more that we didn’t even touch on, probably a few that we shouldn’t touch on.
Jerry Elkins (56:09.636)
Well, I’ll tell you what, this next spring, so we’ve got a winter home now, we go back to Sheridan and live at Misty’s in the winter and we’re staying out here in the summer until the place sells. But in the winter, I’m going to go back and try and maybe wrap up my diary autobiography and I’ll send you a
editing copy, an early preview, and that might then go, yeah, we do need to talk about that or something. You know, it’ll, it’ll, yeah, yeah, yeah. Now you understand.
Jason Elkins (56:45.952)
I’ll just take it right to my therapist. Okay. Sit down with her. We can read it together. And she, she’s like, wow, I’ve never had a client bring me such a, like an owner’s manual to all of your emotional problems.
Jerry Elkins (56:57.124)
Proof. Yeah, okay. Yeah, I think we can go to Oprah with this now. Of course, I guess Oprah’s not around anymore. I don’t know.
Jason Elkins (57:05.154)
Or I just, I just, it just uploaded into chat GPT chat GPT can help me figure out what’s wrong. Why am I the way I am? Anyway, I, I value the way I am. It doesn’t mean it’s always been easy, but that, that get in the basket, you know, and the ability to figure your shit out along the way is a really valuable thing that you, that you shared with me. So thank you for that.
Jerry Elkins (57:13.218)
Ha ha ha.
Jerry Elkins (57:26.361)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (57:31.766)
Let’s do this again sometime.
Jerry Elkins (57:34.178)
Yes, I cannot make promises, but I would love when this place sells to meet you wherever you are. And I hope you start working a diary type of thing because you have a lot of worldly experience that, you know.
Jason Elkins (57:43.318)
Sounds good. I look forward to it.
Jerry Elkins (57:54.978)
And when you were young, you’d been in every state in the Union before you graduated high school. Then you were in France and Australia. And those are nothing compared to what you’ve been doing the last five years. It’s like you’ve, you’re just, how many countries haven’t you been to?
Jason Elkins (58:10.882)
It’s been a good adventure. Well, there’s, more that I have not been to that’s that’s for sure. And there’s, so many on the list, but I’m, you know, we’re doing this call. I’m here in Tbilisi, Georgia, the country of Georgia. I feel like I always need to say the country. well, you’re there in Nevada and my challenges every time I show up somewhere, I start, I look at the map and I’m like, wow. Okay. Look what’s.
So close. Iran is really close by Kazakhstan, Russia. Look at all these amazing places I can go visit. But I, but I didn’t, can’t tell my parents that. So forget I said some of that, but it’s a, it’s been an adventure and I, I absolutely can’t really imagine having done what I’ve done over the last 52 now over the last.
Jerry Elkins (58:48.695)
Please don’t. Yeah. Yeah.
Jason Elkins (59:06.304)
Well, 40 years, because I started learning to fly balloons when I was 12. So if I just use that as a point of it’s not where it all started, but it kind of feels sometimes like that. So the opportunities that I’ve had over the last 40 years as a result of that have been pretty incredible. So thanks dad.
Jerry Elkins (59:24.309)
Well, thank you. I love you a lot. I think you know that. real FaceTime somewhere, real FaceTime, whenever we can.
Jason Elkins (59:26.828)
All right. I love you too. I do.
Jason Elkins (59:35.87)
All right, sounds good. And to all of our listeners that are still here with us, I know this was a little different than what we’ve done in the past, but it was a real special moment for me. And I trust that you got some good takeaways or at least an interesting story. And dad, thanks for coming on and making that possible.
Jerry Elkins (59:54.029)
Thank you for having me. This has been great.
Jason Elkins (59:55.01)
All right. It’s been a lot of fun. I’ll talk to real soon. Bye dad.
Jerry Elkins (59:58.911)
Alrighty, love you. Bye.
Jason Elkins (01:00:05.122)
Good.
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