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Enjoy early access to Linda’s story here; before it is published to all of the popular platforms on November 3, 2026.

Episode #213: Linda Shepro

Founder & CEO

Latitude Expeditions

Episode #213: Linda Shepro
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Guest Bio

Linda Shepro is the founder and CEO of Latitude Expeditions, a travel advisory firm specializing in authentic, firsthand experiences across Africa, the Middle East, Australia and the South Pacific, and Central and South America. With over 30 years of experience in financial consulting and a deep passion for travel, Linda and her team spend up to a year annually vetting properties and experiences to curate personalized itineraries. Her expertise includes destinations such as Zambia, South Africa, and India, with a focus on family travel, adventure, and uniquely immersive journeys. Linda’s approach is rooted in direct experience and strong relationships with trusted Destination Management Companies, allowing her to offer clients detailed insights and 24/7 local support throughout their travels.

Show Summary

In this episode of the Big World Made Small Adventure Travel Podcast, host Jason Elkins sits down with Linda Shepro to explore the art and craft of crafting deeply personalized, adventurous travel experiences. Linda shares how her background in finance and decades of international travel laid the foundation for Latitude Expeditions, a company dedicated to delivering trips that go beyond the typical tourist paths by immersing travelers in the culture and natural beauty of each destination.

Listeners learn about the challenges and rewards of vetting travel properties firsthand, the importance of strong local partnerships, and the thoughtful process behind designing trips that accommodate diverse interests and budgets. Linda also offers insights into emerging travel trends for 2026, including a growing desire for slower, value-driven travel and purpose-filled journeys that connect travelers to their heritage or support local communities.

Key Takeaways

  • ✓ Latitude Expeditions only offers experiences that Linda and her team have personally vetted and explored.
  • ✓ Strong, personal relationships with local Destination Management Companies ensure reliable 24/7 support and insider access for travelers.
  • ✓ Customized itineraries are crafted to reflect each client’s unique interests, whether family-oriented, adventurous, or culturally immersive.
  • ✓ Group travel is thoughtfully managed, often reserved for friends or multi-generational families to ensure compatibility and enjoyment.
  • ✓ Linda emphasizes upfront video calls with clients to fully understand their needs before tailoring any proposals.
  • ✓ Transparency about budgets and expectations helps align trips with client goals and avoids disappointment.
  • ✓ Continuous communication before, during, and after the trip ensures issues are addressed promptly and clients feel supported.
  • ✓ Success in travel planning comes from combining creativity with logistical precision to deliver memorable experiences.
  • ✓ Travel trends for 2026 point to slower itineraries, value-seeking behaviors, heritage travel, and philanthropic journeys.
  • ✓ Linda advises travel professionals and clients alike to prioritize detailed communication and personal connections over generic recommendations.

What You’ll Find on Latitude Expeditions

  • ✓ Travel itineraries built exclusively from firsthand experience and thorough research.
  • ✓ Deep knowledge of exotic and off-the-beaten-path destinations, especially in Africa, the Middle East, Australia, and the Americas.
  • ✓ Personalized attention to each client’s interests, including specialized family travel and unique cultural opportunities.
  • ✓ Access to trusted local partners who provide 24/7 support and insider insights throughout the journey.
  • ✓ Collaborative trip design that avoids generic “what’s hot” lists in favor of what’s truly best for the client.
  • ✓ Transparent communication and detailed pre-trip briefings to prepare clients for what to expect on arrival.

Learn more about Latitude Expeditions and connect with Linda at:

https://Latitudexp.com

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Podcast Transcript

This transcript is auto-generated on recording, and has not been edited by a human. It may contain lots of mistakes, crazy words, and stuff that makes no sense. The host and the guest are not responsible for the accuracy of the transcript.

Jason (01:09)
Welcome back everybody to another episode of the Big World Made Small podcast for the adventure traveler. So happy to have each and every one of you back today, and I’m excited to have our guest. Today we’ve got Linda Shepro. Linda is the founder and CEO of Latitude Expeditions. Linda, welcome to the show. Happy to have you here.

Linda Shepro (01:28)
thank you. Thank you for having me on. I appreciate it.

Jason (01:31)
It’s gonna be a lot of fun. I had a conversation with you about a week or two ago and it just I thought it went swimmingly well and we thought we’d just come back and and do it again and dig a little deeper. A lot deeper because we didn’t go that deep last time. So happy, happy to have you here. Linda, where where do you live? Where are you located?

Linda Shepro (01:48)
I’m located in Carlsbad, California, a suburb of San Diego.

Jason (01:53)
All right, very cool. I’m actually just, I don’t know if I’d say up the road, down the road, whatever, but I’m I’m physically in Arizona right now. A lot of our listeners know that I travel quite a bit, but this is about as close as I’ve ever been to a guest while we’ve recorded a conversation. So I feel like we’re almost in the same room. So anyway, it’s gonna gonna be a lot of fun. Linda, we’re gonna dig probably deeper into your childhood traumas and your background and all that stuff that helped kind of lead your path to get you from where you were to where you are now.

But before we do that, let’s give our listeners kind of an idea, maybe the 60 seconds, six minutes, how we’ll see how it goes, but kind of the elevator pitch for what is latitude expeditions? What is it that you do to serve your clients?

Linda Shepro (02:35)
Latitude Expeditions is a travel advisory firm that I began about ten years ago, really reflecting my love of travel and my curiosity and then wanting to share that with

other people and other guests. So what we do is spend a lot of time on the road as you do investigating different properties, different services, different guiding, different experiences in those places in the world that are really hard for people to figure out on their own, either because there’s too many choices, there’s too much information to wade through about a particular place. And if you

just did it

On the internet, how are you really going to know that it’s a the right fit for you with all those choices? So we tend to do what’s I would call the more exotic vacations, but what we do is we only sell those things that we know. So we do spend a lot of time out in the world investigating various places and making sure that it fits a client’s budget, their bucket lists, their

you know, the things that they want to do there, the way that they like to travel, the way they like to stay in the properties they like to stay in. So it’s kind of putting a puzzle together. So we are a firm of we have three full-time people and then we have some independent contractors as well. We have five or six of them.

Jason (03:52)
Very cool. I’m curious, you use the word exotic, and that could mean so many things to so many people. Somebody that’s never left their hometown, maybe the next state over is exotic. So I’m curious what is what do you mean by that? Do you kind of have certain criteria that fits exotic? Or I mean maybe you just use the term, but give me kind of an idea what you’re talking about when you say that.

Linda Shepro (04:12)
I think exotic means different, different cultures, different experiences than we’re used to on a on a daily basis, or or even in our travel. So if you travel to Europe, would I call that exotic? No, I wouldn’t call that exotic. I mean, that lifestyle is similar to our lifestyle, obviously, you know, older culture and history, but not really that much different than the way we live today. So so we tend to go into those places that

that

are Africa’s a big one for us and obviously culturally that is very different and it’s different from country to country in Africa. So not only do we you know look at the w wildlife, we try to immerse guests into the actual experiences of the way people live and experience their culture and their history through their eyes. So that to me is exotic. you need to be prepared to

be accepta accepting or are tolerable to those kind of cultures and institutions because they are different than ours. But that’s how we really learn in the world. That’s how we satisfy our curiosity. That’s how we become one world. So

Exotic, I mean, you might say, it’s exotic going to, you know, some islands in the Maldives. and in and that is exotic and we can do those kind of things, but it is not what I think is difficult to do on your own. I think what we do is difficult to figure out on your own. So to me that’s I guess the definition of exotic.

Jason (05:36)
I’m sensing

from you, I heard you say, you know, we we specialize in those things that are difficult for people to do on their own. But really what I’m hearing is things that are just interesting to you. I don’t know if that’s the case, but we talk about exotic, we talk about difficult. It’s like, no, what’s exciting for you sounds like things that are a little bit more off the beaten path, I guess is one way to put that.

Linda Shepro (05:57)
Yeah, definitely off the beaten path. Although, you know, you can go to all sorts of places in in places we serve that aren’t off the beaten path, you know, you c you can go

stay in the four seasons in Buenos Aires and you can, you know, walk around the neighborhoods and do all that. But if you want to dive deeper into a culture or you want you want a cooking class, you want to understand, you know, more about the history and culture, then you’re going to want to ask to have some guiding, some expert guiding to to to help you really experience the those things. So that’s what we’re all about. We’re gonna help you dive deeper into a place and we’re also going to be able to match

The type of accommodations that you’re looking for. Do you want to stay in a cheaper hotel in the Galapagos Islands, or do you want to stay on a boat? Or do you want to stay in Santa Cruz and be at a Safari Lodge type place? It all depends what your goal is or your interests are. Are there boats to do that on, or do I do that from the land? All of those types of things have to go into planning for these vacations.

so that people can get everything they’re looking for and the value that they are looking for against the budget that they have to spend on the trip.

Jason (07:09)
Right,

very cool. You know, sometimes companies spend time and effort and you’ve got a lot of success in business. I don’t know if this is something you’ve done or th or thought about, but where I’m going with this is sometimes we kinda like, okay, the services I offer are good for X type of person and there’s other people that it’s not good for. So that might look like

if you’re the type of person that likes X, Y, or Z, then we might be the right fit for you. And if you’re the type of person that likes A, B, C, then maybe we’re not the right fit. Do you have kind of a way to describe who who is your business for?

Linda Shepro (07:44)
our business is for

People that are really looking for more of what we’ll call four and five-star properties, not necessarily you know budget trips. We do get a lot of those requests. We’ll get a lot of those requests from children of clients and guests that we have that maybe don’t have the budget. We can serve those those clients, but we have to really educate them, probably more than you know, what what our typical client is.

Because

of the connections that I have in the industry, I’ve been doing this probably for about 15 years, 10 on my own. I am able to talk to others in the industry who I trust that can take on those clients. I have an affiliate in in Europe who will take on our European clients. And she can do a range of budget, you know, from the really low budget to honeymoons to the

mid-budget, we tend to take on the high end, but I use her as my affiliate to to really get that done because she knows Europe more than our team knows Europe. But people again like us kind of quarterbacking it and being involved. So we can find those answers for people. So I’ll have people come to me with a budget and I can tell them, you know, pretty quickly, is this going to work or how’s this going to work or can I help you? But if I can, then I can refer them to

other people.

And I’ve been very successful in doing that because I have met so many people in this industry. And I test them. I make sure they’re quality people or people I know well. One example of that is cruises. A lot of people like to do the big cruises. I know nothing about cruises, but I know the people who know. But if you want to do a Nat Geo cruise or you want to do a cruise down the Nile River or you want to do something, you know, that’s a small boat type option.

we can do those because those are, I guess, more explorative, more exotic, more immersing in the culture. So we do do that type of things. But when it comes to, you know, what we don’t know, we’re first to tell clients, we don’t, we don’t know this, but we know how to connect you and we know where you can go. So that’s that’s how we kind of work.

Jason (09:47)
I have two questions right now off the bat that are probably the same question. so we’ll last the one, we’ll see what this where the second one goes. So I recognize that a lot of your traveling, probably for the last 15 years, has been through the eyes of somebody working in the business. Like, what would my clients think of this? Is this something that would resonate well with people that have worked with me? Da-da-da-da-da, all this stuff. And I guess it the question is.

What is your like have you taken a vacation in the last 15 years? And what does that look like when when you and your husband Bob go on vacation? Like what is exciting for you? Because it doesn’t necessarily align with the types of places you visit when you’re looking at it through the lens of somebody that’s in the business.

Linda Shepro (10:33)
Well that’s pretty interesting. There’s I think there’s two factors there. We have to look at it when we travel through the lens of

people because people are different and people have different budgets,

Jason (10:41)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (10:42)
etc. And the hardest thing for us when we’re traveling and we’re checking out these properties, and I’ll give you some examples of that, is trying to decide, I love this, this is for me, but it may not be for you or it may not be for another client or it may not fit their budget or what have you. So we always have to be you know trying to evaluate a property that we might not stay in, either because it’s too high end or it’s too low

end.

Or there’s something that’s different about it for us, but we have to know enough about it to be able to advise a client. This is this fits your budget, this is what you should expect, this is how this differs from this property, etc. So so I do kind of consider my job always on vacation, at least for three or four months of the year. most people would not think of that as a vacation because I I’m leaving for Zambia in a week. and

And

the example of that is I will probably stay in fifteen different properties in 15 different days. And then I added some t some time at the end of that where I actually have two days in one place. I call that my laundry stop.

Jason (11:48)
I could relate to that. Yeah, I gotcha.

Linda Shepro (11:50)
But it’s

you know, I’m still on safari. I’m still, you know, although I’m checking out the guys and I’m checking out the food and I’m checking out the the wildlife and the people, I’m s I’m s I’m still enjoying it, right? I might be moving a lot,

from day to day. but again, it’s it’s it’s all vacation to me. Bob and I recently went to South Africa and we did the same sort of thing. I went for a big conference that we have with suppliers and and other agents from around the world. And after we we spent a couple of times in Cape Town, but we work when we’re there. But again, you know that that that that almost feels like a vacation because it’s different. It’s it’s different than our life here. but then after the

Conference, we went on a road trip for three weeks and visited 26 different properties. Again, we had a couple of two days for laundry stops along the way, but again, it’s it’s it’s an exciting way to travel. What I do tell you though is when I have a group of friends that says to me, I want to go to Argentina and I will only go if you go. Well, now I’m gonna design that trip around them, they’re

gonna stay.

in a place for three or four days. They’re gonna they’re not gonna hop around like we do. So that’s when Bob and I feel like we really have a vacation. We may be leading this group, but hey, we’re getting to enjoy it and not be living out of a suitcase a as much. The other vacations we do are with our our kids and our our family. So those are true vacations, you know, that s so so that we can really relax and not be leading anybody.

Jason (13:22)
Well, it’s you know, y you mentioned vacation friends, family, was family. Maybe it’s too private to ask, but what does that look like? Because I really I because I heard everything you said and I get it. I’ve I’ve spent some time doing that where you’re so fortunate to be able to go visit all these places, but other people might look at it and say, Well geez, you’re moving every day, so that doesn’t sound very relaxing. But when you do I guess what I want to know is

Have you been places? I I apparently you have because you mentioned family. But where I’m going with this, it’s like you go to a place and like nobody there knows you even work in the business and they’re not trying to show you everything and they’re not trying to, well, geez, Linda, how many people do you think you can send? What do we need to do better? What do we, you know, because I know all those questions where you just show up and you’re somewhere for a week and you’re just like

Not checked out because I don’t think you ever check out, Linda, but but where you’re just like full on vacation. I don’t even want to think about sending people here. Or maybe a place where you decide yeah, maybe this is a better question. Has there been a place where you’re like, yeah, I’d probably never send anybody there? None of my clients, nobody I know would want to go there, but I want to go there and I don’t plan on ever sending anybody there, so I’m not even gonna ask for any sort of fam trip or anything like that. I just want to go there.

Are there places like that?

Linda Shepro (14:42)
Yeah, there are, for sure. But I do want to point this out. When when we as agents go out and look at properties, the sales manager knows. The owner may know of that property, who we are. Those guides don’t know. Those those

Those service people don’t know because we would not be getting a valid feel with for the place. So it’s pretty important that they don’t know.

Jason (15:05)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (15:06)
we did have a situation last year where there were some guests and they started talking to us and asking us in the in the vehicle like why we knew so much and then we said, we’re in the business. And the guy d wh whipped around and he was like, What? You’re in the business? You know, I mean he didn’t like it because he didn’t know ahead of time. So

Jason (15:22)
’cause he didn’t know.

Linda Shepro (15:23)
we we try not to we we try not

not to reveal that and there they they want honest feedback. I mean the the the owners, the salespeople, the you know the company wants us to come back and say this happened or that happened or I wouldn’t use this guide or I would change this or all that stuff is extremely important to them and we can’t be shy about telling them so

Jason (15:44)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (15:44)
that they can improve their services. But your question about that family experience I think one of the best vacations we ever did is we went

Spain and Portugal with our kids, and I had no intention of ever like selling Morocco. Spain, obviously I tell you I don’t really do Europe. so so those we were totally free to investigate on our own. But when we got back and people started asking us about our trip, or had we ever been there, now we know something about it, right? So

Jason (16:11)
Tends to come up, doesn’t it?

Linda Shepro (16:13)
It does come up. So so but but that was not done with any intention to ever sell it. And was my my kids were like, Why are we going to Morocco? and I said, Because it’s inexpensive and I can take you and I want to see it. I’m really interested in it. And they came back and told me it was one of the best trips they ever had. So the the other question you have is I’ve I know some suppliers in in Western Africa.

And I’m very fascinated with Western Africa because of the culture, the festivals, the you know, the the the dress, the beliefs, very, very different than what we sell in safari Africa. you know, you may have some wildlife there, but you’re not going on safari and looking for that wildlife. You probably don’t even want to find it. That’s not something I can

Jason (16:58)
Wait, wait, wait, wait. I I wouldn’t be a very

good podcast if I didn’t stop you on that. What would you not want to find ’cause I don’t know anything about West Africa or very little. Okay. I

Linda Shepro (17:06)
I’ve probably a snake or if

those type of things. I don’t know, you might run

into y I don’t think

Jason (17:11)
Yeah.

Linda Shepro (17:12)
there’s any lions in that area, but there could be, who knows? but that’s not something I would I mean, we’ve been invited to go. And it’s not something that I’ve taken up with the suppliers because I’m like, i if i if I’m gonna go there on your dime, I’m gonna wanna sell it. I’m gonna wanna know that I can sell it.

But I don’t think I can sell it. And maybe I can. Maybe it’s like Morocco that like I went and then people are going, that’s really cool. I wanna go. But it my intention would be because Bob and I want to go. So I am planning that type of

excursion and I will not ask them for special rates. I will just say, hey, I I’m there for me. I want to see what this is all about. And maybe it leads to something, but that is not my intention. My intention is to really experience that. a lot of the other places on my bucket list, I would go and see but

I think people are interested in those as well because they’re they’re generally pretty exotic places to go. so I hope that answers that question.

Jason (18:11)
No, no, that’s

I I appreciate that because I went through a a stint of about a decade where I was working for a tour operator, had the opportunity to go pretty much anywhere I wanted to go and I chose places that I thought we could sell because that seems reasonable. They were paying for me to go and the the destinations were, you know, helping make it make it happen. And I remember during that time

Maybe our partners weren’t so good at keeping things quiet. I I I work for a company called Orvis, a fly fishing company. I visited a lot of fly

Linda Shepro (18:42)
Mm-hmm.

Jason (18:43)
fly fishing type destinations, high-end fly fishing destinations. And the guide always knew where I was from. It didn’t. Like I I would ask the manager, I’m like, hey, let’s kind of keep it on the download. And I’d get in the boat and they’re like, you’re the guy from Orvis, which also meant you better know how to fish. So

Linda Shepro (19:00)
Ha ha.

Jason (19:00)
there it was. So it was like I net or the guests, you know, oftentimes

I would get there and and the guests that were already there already knew the guy from Ore of Us was gonna be there. So I’d sit down at dinner the first night and they’d start telling me about their their bamboo fly rod that their parent their grandfather given them or their waders that leaked or whatever. And it was just so I always felt like I was on everywhere I went at every moment. And I think I took one vacation during that that time period. I went somewhere with my wife where we had no business affili business affiliations or anything. And it was it was I don’t know, it was kind of nice actually. So

Linda Shepro (19:33)
It was kinda nice. But it is funny,

Jason (19:33)
That’s what made me ask. But

Linda Shepro (19:36)
when you bring that up, you know, so we drive a car when we’re in South Africa and we’re staying in the place for a day here, a day there, whatever. They just think we’re just kinda

crazy check it off, you know, the list people. They don’t

and it’s they is it is it’s always funny to me that they don’t the the guides at least they don’t act the guides and the service people they don’t act like we’re in the business or insane. Like they yeah, they just think we’re insane. And that we’re just trying

Jason (20:05)
Yeah.

Linda Shepro (20:05)
to tick it all off. And then yeah, it’s it’s it it’s it’s different. And then the other thing we always say to each other if we’re in a vehicle like in so far

With other people. We know a lot of the behavior of the animals. Obviously, we’ve been doing it for hundreds and hundreds of times. And if people aren’t asking questions, we’ll start asking questions. You know, we might know the answer, but we ask those questions. And so that kind of adds to it that at least the guests and the guide kind of don’t think we are doing what we’re doing. But we also say

to each other, Bob and I. Don’t ever correct the guide. He might say something that’s like really crazy that you are like, I know something about this but y you just don’t say anything and

Jason (20:46)
Do you have you guys had the experience where because obviously you’re very knowledgeable. And of course, I suspect there’s a lot of times the guide says something. You may have seen the same type of behavior a hundred times with a hundred different guides, and then you’ve got this one off guide that says something totally off the wall. And I’m sure you’re like looking at each other, but you’re not gonna necessarily correct him in front of the the other guests. but I guess more interestingly, I don’t know if it’s interesting or not, but

I also imagine that there’s times that you’re in the vehicle on Safari with some other guests that are quite proud of themselves for their knowledge is maybe one way to put it. Full of themselves might be another way to put it.

Linda Shepro (21:26)
Yeah.

Jason (21:27)
but I’m sure you’ve had some RPGs where you’re just sitting there, you and Bob are looking at each other, and this this guy over here from wherever he’s from is kind of sharpshooting the guide or just talking about everything they know and and

I don’t know where the question is there, but you’ve seen that and

Linda Shepro (21:43)
yeah, it happens all the time. It’s o it’s fine. I mean the

Jason (21:46)
What do you want

to maybe what do you want to say to potential guests that might book a trip with you about don’t be that guy on Safari? I don’t know. Do you give advice on how to not be that guy?

Linda Shepro (21:54)
We give a little bit of advice about what to do in a safari vehicle.

some of it’s not talking all the time. You’re gonna scare the animals away and maybe the guide as well. and then

Jason (22:04)
Hmm.

Linda Shepro (22:06)
we tell other people in a safari vehicle if you really want to be alone, just say you’re a birder. And and the other guests will might go get a private vehicle or something. So

Jason (22:15)
They’ll leave you alone.

Linda Shepro (22:17)
that that’s just a little joke that we tell people. But no,

Jason (22:19)
Yeah. It’s a

Linda Shepro (22:22)
you’re gonna you’re gonna run into that all all all the way through. The other thing that I really try to encourage people who go on these trips, w you know, for the most part in in in Africa you are gonna share a vehicle with other guests.

And I tell people there’s a lot of beauty in that because you’re gonna learn from those other guests. They’re gonna be people just like you. they might be from a different country, a different state, a different whatever, but you’re gonna make friends because you guys do have the same interests. so so even if people want to pay for a private vehicle, I often encourage them that you’re gonna have a lot more fun if you’re with a group of people than just on your own. But when you’re

Jason (22:58)
That’s but

Linda Shepro (22:58)
traveling to other parts of the country, you really want to give people private.

experiences. and

you know you don’t want to be on these group trips that you’re you’re waiting for people or you’re people are asking so many questions you can’t even ask the question yourself or you’re s you’re lingering too long at a place or you’re being too short at a place. You really want the experience, you know, at the at this level of of of

of expenditure and time to be able to have the guy’s full attention, to be able to say, you know, that’s a nice waterfall, but I’m done, I’m ready to go on. Or I’ve seen enough castles. I don’t want to see another one. You know, let’s hop on a bike and instead of walking somewhere. You know, that type of thing. You’ve got to have that dialogue with your guide, the suppliers, in order to really have a fulfilling time. So I think group tours

Work for a lot of people, it definitely works for people who are single and want to travel to these places. You are going to find people like you. You are going to find people with the same interests. But we tend not to do that. The only group tours we do are for friends, you know, it’s a group of friends. and or it’s a you know multi-generational family.

And those are hard enough, you know, to try to

Jason (24:12)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (24:12)
make sure that everybody’s happy. You know, is it are the kids happy? Or are they gonna be wanting to look at their iPad all day? Or, you know, is how much is too much safari for a twelve year old versus a twenty-five-year-old? you know, all of those type of things are are how we try to guide people.

Jason (24:29)
curious when you

say that when you do them now it’s more s mostly a group of friends. Are these people that are your friends or everybody kind of knows each other? What does that typically look like?

Linda Shepro (24:40)
No, well our typical client is n is not that. Our typical client is a couple or a family unit. for a group.

Jason (24:44)
Well, I mean, but the people but you mentioned like you do some you set up

some groups for a f group of friends. Does that mean you’re friends with all of them or are they all

Linda Shepro (24:51)
The only the I have agents, I have some

Jason (24:53)
friends of each other?

Linda Shepro (24:55)
well, I have independent agents who like to do group tours. and so I have

Jason (24:58)
Okay. Okay, gotcha.

Linda Shepro (24:59)
one who’s a a yoga Pilates instructor and so she she will go to her clientele and maybe a couple of those will be her friends. I have another guy who is a photographer and he tends to do a lot of

a lot of interesting landscapes, wildlife, et cetera. sometimes he’ll s do some trips on his own, but he is also an agent for me and he will bring friends and friends of friends and kids of friends and whatever. But everybody is connected in one way. I don’t tend to do group trips unless people ask us to. And people will say, you know, I’ve we went to Zambia a couple years ago and we had 10 friends that’d never been to Africa before and they go,

We wanna go to Africa, w you guys go with us and I designed a trip about my favorite country which is Zambia, and they had why are we going to Zambia? Because that’s where I want to go and you’re gonna love it and it’s gonna be a great introduction to Africa. So so we we did that and then the people were so excited about what we accomplished there, they all became friends. They were they were all people we knew, but they didn’t necessarily know each other. But now they’re bonded, they’re friends. So the next year we’re

We all went back to India. So now we’ve got these new friends with these old friends, and you know, they’re communicating on their own. This year we’re starting with a few of those people back to Africa in April, and we started with a group of five, and they were all friends, of three friends of ours and us who wanted to go on this trip. Now we have 12 because people would ask other friends. But I would talk to those people first. I want to make sure that they’re going to fit with everybody else.

Right? So we have a conversation before I even

Jason (26:34)
This I

Linda Shepro (26:37)
find out if there’s a room available for you. So now now

Jason (26:40)
I’m

Linda Shepro (26:40)
we have twelve.

Jason (26:41)
I’m curious, Linda, was this something learned the hard way? The cause the question is like, okay, go back fifteen years when you started this, because sometimes people get into it really ambitious about I want to put to call these group departures. You sound like somebody that’s speaking from experience. So I’m curious, did you do more group departures early on? And that’s why you’re not so excited about them anymore unless unless they’re group of friends?

Linda Shepro (27:04)
I think groups are harder for people to have. I I think groups are great if people all know each other and can kind of bounce off other people and not just be with the same person the whole time. But I do think you have to be careful about having extra strong personalities in there. my experience was early on, I think first or second trip I did, it was

It was friends, they weren’t friends of mine. They were friends, but they said they wanted me to go with them on the trip. And they didn’t really get along. I mean there were there’s certain things that happened that they would be you know, so it’s a it’s you have to be a psychologist too. You have to be able to manage those situations. So sometimes you’ll see that that happen, that people like, this is my great friend, but I’ve not traveled with them before. So

Jason (27:48)
Th things change

when you travel with somebody, some sometimes.

Linda Shepro (27:51)
s things

do change. And and I did early on when Bob was working his full time and not able to travel with me, I did a lot of those on my own. But now that I have him I have someone to kind of balance that too. Because if you do have if you do have an issue, I have someone to bounce it off of that says, how do we handle this or do we go to you know, that that type of thing. So s th there is some of that, but what I have to remind people is that humor is the most important

sense in this world and you better have it. If you’re traveling with a group of people, you better bring your sense of humor and go with the flow. Yeah.

Jason (28:26)
But I I

like what I love what you mentioned about Bob just kind of bouncing things around or ’cause I’d spent some time managing a resort in Belize, which was basically a group trip every week. We’d get a new group of guests every Saturday and was through the following Saturday. But I was fortunate that I’d had my my fiance at the time was there. She’s got a different enough personality that it it worked great. I could be like, this woman’s driving me crazy and Tanya’d be like, I got this, Jason, don’t worry about it.

And she’d go over there and like they were best friends right away, or vice versa. And it was it was so much better. And then I’ve led a lot of group trips by myself. And it’s like, my gosh, you gotta be kind of everything for everybody when it’s just you as the group leader. So I can that’s why I th I sense that maybe you learned some of this the hard way

early on.

Linda Shepro (29:12)
Yeah, you learn some of it. And and I guess my biggest

worry out there is when I have an agent leading a group and they might have a couple randoms in there. I I I I try to I I said, I’m your sounding board, call me in the middle of the night, I’ll tell you how to handle this and we’ll we we’ll go from there. But you’ve got to be able to go with the flow. And they’ve got those leaders have to be leaders. They can’t just be I’m on vacation, you know. they need to be a leader.

Jason (29:35)
Yes.

That’s that’s a super big one because a lot of people maybe they have a lot of friends and maybe they envision themselves, you know, they want to work in the travel business and they think I’m just gonna, you know, set up a trip and take people with them with me, but there’s so much more to it than that, which I think, you know, you just touched on. do you what do you think is the most important skill for a trip leader?

Linda Shepro (30:00)
humor. Patience and humor. Yeah, yeah,

Jason (30:01)
yeah, you pretty much in that. Yeah. Yeah, that’s the

Linda Shepro (30:03)
you gotta have a sense of humor. And and that is that also means you probably have some good patience and and you y you’ve gotta know how to w work around things, you know, if if if people are s struggling and you gotta be able to approach maybe a manager of the resort or you have to be able to

You know, just figure out what the dynamics are and try to work around those. So

Jason (30:24)
Yeah. I just

just had a conversation with someone recently. We discussed bartenders to make good like group people that have been bartenders in the past. I’m not saying you go straight from the bar to being a trip leader, but people that at some point in you know when they were going through school or whatever, they put themselves through the school’s bartender ’cause they’re dealing with a wide variety of different people, different levels of enjoyment or whatever, and being able to set boundaries but at the same time make everybody kinda you know, so

Anyway, it’s it’s quite a quite quite a job.

Linda Shepro (30:52)
Yeah. The other thing that becomes

difficult about putting a group together is that you have different levels of budget and then with

Jason (31:00)
yeah. Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (31:01)
that different expectations. So if you have a group that that that’s out there like

I ha I recently had a group and they said, we really had a great time with this other family. There were two families together and they’d never traveled together. One family had much greater resources than the other, but we built the trip for the first family, then they invited another family. They came back and they go

you know, our friends had this experience and that experience, but our experience was this. But it was because we managed to a certain budget. And it would have been much better if we had been able to either talk to both families together before the trip was planned or to do two separate trips. And I think the I think the second family realized that, but the first one didn’t. So that’s a

Jason (31:47)
Yeah.

Linda Shepro (31:47)
disappointment to me because I if you just add people to your trip, do I know?

it’s the right trip for them, right? I it

Jason (31:54)
Yeah.

Linda Shepro (31:54)
that’s that’s a tough thing and I and I have I have that going on all the time is that my friend heard about my trip. They really want to go. And it’s like okay but I gotta tell them what it’s all about. I need to basically interview them. And

Jason (32:08)
And

then how and then you’re in a tough spot. Maybe you figured it out. Well, I don’t know. Have you figured it out? How do you you just straight out

Linda Shepro (32:15)
You talk to them before you find out.

Jason (32:17)
say, Look, this is what I’ve set up for your friends and figure out if it’s gonna work for them. You’ve got to, yeah.

Linda Shepro (32:21)
I think you’ve gotta be honest, you gotta say, I think

you would enjoy this more. I I also use feedback from other guests to kind of walk through that too. I do that in planning as well. so if I get feedback from from a guest like the other day I got a feedback from a guest that went to Japan.

And the guide wanted to spend too much time on one of the art islands in Japan and they were like, you know, for the time we spent, it wasn’t really worth it. And I don’t you know, it was they had one quoted price for the whole trip, so they didn’t really even know how expensive it was. But I went back and looked at it, and I have people going now to Japan and I’m saying, boy, this particular experience adds X amount to your trip. I might not do it. And they’ve told me they want to do it. Their research said they

they

want to do it, but now I can use I can use those, you know, experiences to kind of shape what what people’s experiences are going to be. Because I I don’t want another disappointment if if I suggested something or let something happen. The other thing is

We can control too like if I if I had someone coming on this trip of twelve that I hadn’t interviewed and I’d not think was a good fit, I can come back and say there’s no rooms available. I mean I’m I’m dealing with small boutique places and they sell out. Y Yeah.

Jason (33:36)
We’re getting the behind the scenes on Linda today. It’s like what’s happening in the background. I love that. But

Linda Shepro (33:42)
I mean you can do you can do that. of unfortunately

Yeah, I mean, you have one percent of the people that are probably an issue. It’s ninety nine percent are great to work with and it and you can make it happen. And and we’re there. You know, Bob and I are there, so we’ll be fine.

Jason (33:59)
What’s

so what is the typical process for you? Some you know, some companies will do everything by email. And then there’s other companies that are like, I’m not even gonna start until I’ve done a video call with you and and really dig deep. What is your approach with that with maybe let’s take maybe a n a new potential client that you haven’t worked with before? What do you do you like to get on a video call or do you like to work things out ahead of time or what does it look like?

Linda Shepro (34:22)
yeah, absolutely.

Must do. Must do a call. You cannot you cannot

Jason (34:25)
Yeah, I I had a feeling you were gonna say that. I did not know the answer to that, but I kinda thought you were gonna say that. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (34:30)
communicate via via email. Some people don’t want to jump on a a video call, so you just WhatsApp or you have a Converse call for them. eventually you you you bring things. Yeah, exactly. Some people don’t want to

Jason (34:39)
Why do you think that is? Let’s get into psychology now. Let’s let’s let’s analyze

Linda Shepro (34:45)
be

Jason (34:45)
the everybody you’ve talked to the last fifteen years, but what do you think it is? Do you have some people that don’t even want to get on any call at any time and they just say let’s work it all all out by email? And if so, what it no?

Linda Shepro (34:56)
No, no.

Jason (34:57)
Okay.

Linda Shepro (34:58)
You’ll have people that are comfortable with with us after they work with us that’ll say, you know, let’s just email back and forth and and we’ll do it. But th they have to be comfortable with us and we have to be comfortable with them. And then when we do the we always do a not only do we we do that and we’ll have several calls and then

you we’ll develop a proposal and and we’ll send that to via email. they’ll have a app that they can look at, they’ll have a a printout they can look at, and then we tweak it from there. So we’ll go back and forth and a lot of that communication will be via email. But if it’s if it’s a lot of changes are back and forth, then you pick up the phone and you talk through it. And why why are we doing this or why are we doing that? Or

what have you. so it is a lot of hands on. And it’s also on the other side, it’s not all emails to the suppliers. Here I’ve got this client, here’s their MO, here’s what they want to do, here’s their budget, here’s how I think it should go, here’s where I think they should stay. I have to pick up the phone and I have to call them. So I start my day very early at six AM I’m I’m talking to Africa, which is four PM, right? It’s the end of their day, it’s beginning of my day. But if I’ve sent them something

In the night, and they don’t. I, you know, I might prepare them and say, here’s what I want to talk to you about in the morning. You know, here’s here’s an MO, this is what I’m looking for, let’s talk through this. So you’ve really got to do that. And then when changes happen, you have to do that. You have to have that personal connection. And that’s how we find our suppliers, is where do we have a personal connection? Where do I know that they’re going to do their job? They’re going to follow up on the details. They’re going to get back to me quickly.

So I can get back to the client quickly. If they can’t do those things at the beginning, even if they could deliver at the end, I can’t work with them, right? So

Jason (36:40)
Yeah, yeah.

Linda Shepro (36:41)
it it is, it’s all relationships, it’s all communication. And one important thing to think about is when I started in this business, I started as a brand ambassador for a a big tour operator in the US. And I was basically just helping them market, you know, to the people I knew, to the golf club I was a part of, to, you know.

know, business associates that I had. So that was my role of brand ambassador where I started to learn the business. And then they had all of their suppliers that they worked with. And I didn’t work with them directly. I was working with I was client-facing.

And but I got to know who was serving who and who was doing what. And then later the first job I really had in travel doing the whole thing is that I helped a young woman from that company start her own company. And then I really learned the the bones of the business and and what was going on. But when she started and and I was assisting her, we used all the same what we call destination management companies that that this company used.

Today I have two of those left.

Jason (37:43)
Go off. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (37:43)
I

don’t use any of the same people. I went out and found my own people and I you have people calling you all the time and they say, Hey, you’re a travel advisor in the US and you have this type of clients and I want to work with you and I’ll say, Well, why would I want to work with you? You have to prove to me. So so it was a

Jason (37:58)
Yep. Yep.

Linda Shepro (37:59)
it was a you know it was a process of going through and and saying, I I need I need to know that you can deliver what I want. I know that your staff need to deliver what I want. So hey,

guy in Uganda who I don’t know from Adam, like

Bring me out, show me what you have. Let me show you the properties. Let me see where your vehicles look like, your guides, all all of that. So so you you really have to test the waters. I’m not gonna send anybody out if I don’t know. And if you and I use other agents to help me too. I mean, I have people that want to go to Iceland. I’ve never been to Iceland in my life. I said, I can refer you to another agent. They say, No, I want to work with you. I go, okay, I’ll find out. I go to other agents that I trust that are like me, and they can say,

This is who I use and this is why I use. Then I go interview those people, but I also have now, you know, a credibility that’s been given to me by people I trust. But but for the most part, I’ve traveled with everyone that we work with out there. I had one situation where I was struggling with a destination management company in South America, and I was like, these guys just keep dropping the ball, or they some things, details don’t work, you know, prices.

change it was really really frustrating. So again I went back to colleagues and I was like who do you use? Who you use who you use. So I get, you know, I get some some referrals.

I had one company that kept coming up on the referral and it was a small company and I love the small company, the guys that used to be guides and what have you. And I’m trying to get a meeting with this guy at a big conference and I cannot get the meeting. And I am like calling him and blah blah and he’s way busy. He doesn’t can’t talk to me. Can we talk a coffee? Can we do whatever? Finally I was at some place in a guasu falls and he goes, you’re gonna see my friend and I go, Yeah, guy won’t call me back He calls a guy up and he goes, You have to meet this person, you know

y you need to talk s he agreed to meet me. He has been my advisor in Argentina for ten

Jason (39:53)
yeah.

Linda Shepro (39:53)
years. And I we laugh about it ’cause I was like, I I you know, I tracked you down. I would not let you like just, you know and and whatever. So we laugh about it today. So you have to rely on other people in the industry who know things that you might not know. I think at this stage, ten years in, I’m

I pretty much know who to work with, who not to work with, but it ch it can change too. It can change. And you have to stay on

Jason (40:16)
Yeah. I I know that

Linda Shepro (40:18)
it.

Jason (40:19)
Right, yeah. And I know that we’ve got a lot of the people that you were just describing, you know, destination management companies, guys people that started out as guides, started their own business all the type of people that you’re dealing with. a lot of those folks listen to this podcast. A lot of them have been on this podcast. which is one way of kind of conveying a little bit about personality. It’s not everything that you’re gonna look at, of course, but where I’m going with this is

What’s the advice you would give to a somebody that owns a destination management company somewhere that wants to work with somebody like you? most of them have blind spots. What is the biggest piece of advice or best piece of advice you could give them, either to work with you or just to straighten up their their stuff that you’ve seen so many times with so many different operators?

Linda Shepro (41:06)
I think the most important thing to to all of us in this position is to have someone who pays attention to detail. And if I send an email and I’ve got five questions and you only answer three, you’re not. I’m chasing you. Right?

Jason (41:21)
Or they do one at a time, right? I’ve I’ve dealt with a lot

of these a lot of these folks as well. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (41:26)
So, you know, my emails

now I have to have a category for everything and a bullet point and I put numbers on them so that you don’t forget that you didn’t answer all my questions. But that’s the number one thing. There’s there’s several companies in the industry who are fantastic people, salespe, marketing people. We love them. we want to hang out with them at all the parties and all the conferences. They’re consultants.

that they have sitting in the office that are answering their questions are not up to snuff. They’re not they’re not responsive, they’re not detail oriented. they don’t they don’t know their product well enough. you have to remind them, no, I’m not gonna fly into that airport, we’re gonna fly into this airport. yeah, I forgot, you know, that type of thing. So so having really good support staff to us is the most important. and

You know, maybe on the ground, maybe your properties, maybe your guys and everything are really, really great. But if we can’t get through to the front end, we’re not gonna work with you.

Jason (42:25)
Wonder if it’s s some people that make amazing guides and do a great job when they’re starting out as guides, they’ve got that personality or whatever. And they kind of look at it and say, Well, that’s I got all my success from that type of personality. So then, if and when, hopefully when they decide they need people to support them. I think sometimes they just look for the same thing in other people. They’re like, there’s

person also has a great personality, so I’ll make them a coordinator. But they have the same personality as a guide. And typically

Linda Shepro (42:58)
Right.

Jason (42:59)
a great guide is not a great coordinator in my experience. Have you seen that?

Linda Shepro (43:03)
yeah. I w we got a funny story about that. We had a fantastic guide in India with our group of twelve and everybody fell in love with him. And he came to the US and

He had no plan whatsoever. None. He didn’t know where he was staying except with me for a few days and he was gonna stay with another client here or there. Didn’t know what day he was leaving, didn’t have a rental car, didn’t know how to and we just gave him so much grief. We’re like, Harry, you’re not a planner. You should have asked me and and and Onkit in your office to plan your trip for you to the United States because you’re a guide. He just just showed up and he was just gonna make it happen. So we give him a lot of grief about that. We say, you gotta have a planner.

You gotta have and then you gotta have the person who executes the plan. And that’s what the guides do. They execute the plan well. And and i it’s amazing to me how these guys can be do this

It’s not always the same thing ’cause we’re doing custom things, right? And so so this trip looks different than that trip. But how they’re excited like the first time they ever saw a tiger, or the first time they ever saw, you know, a rhino, and but but it’s the hundredth time, it’s the millionth time, right?

Jason (44:07)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (44:07)
how they can still have that joy of discovery of everything that they do. You know, taking you through, you know, some of the cultural places that you see, taking you to the Recoleta Cemetery and talking about that and in but

They’re still there they they’re still vibrant and and you know. But that’s a thing we look at too, i is a place that I love today, maybe it’s changed, maybe it’s under new ownership, maybe there’s new guides there, maybe it’s has a different feel. That’s why we have to keep going back. We don’t have to go back every year, but we do need to go back. And then we also need to talk to our colleagues, you know, whether it’s on a phone call or

meeting them at a conference and we’re always getting together what we call you know us the the advisors, the buyers of those services, and we share information. And that’s what the DMCs also need to know, is that if if if you really drop the ball with one of us, it’s probably gonna spread. We’re probably gonna talk about it.

Jason (45:02)
It’s it’s it’s

a much smaller community than maybe people imagine. Cause you can go on LinkedIn and my gosh, there’s thirty, forty, fifty thousand people working in adventure travel and and we can get raptor, we can think that, we can come up with that impression. But the reality is like, you know, I connected with you through somebody and they connected with me and we all kind I don’t want to say we all

Linda Shepro (45:25)
It’s a small world.

Jason (45:26)
know each other, but sometimes it all f it definitely feels like it.

And especially if there’s a reason to to you know to share to tout somebody either because they’re doing an exceptional job or they’re more of a like, hey, they got some things to work out. You might want to steer clear. steer clear for a while. I almost

Linda Shepro (45:41)
But just yesterday

I had I had an agent that I’d been on with a fam maybe six years ago and we’d become good friends and her mom is in the agen her agency. It’s a her mom and her

And her mom calls me and says, you know, I’m having some issues with my wire processor, like paying these DMCs. And I’m like, who do you use? And I’m like, and so I I I give her the this and make the introductions and give her two different choices and tell her why. And and now, boom, she’s she’s set. We share, right? Those

Jason (46:10)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (46:10)
are my colleagues. Those are the people. But I’ll call them and I’m having some trouble with flight services, and I’m like, well.

who are you guys using? Like what are the and they’ll introduce me to someone and I can ask a lot of questions about that. Like how long you’ve been using What do you think about this? Or this seems a little wonky or that that’s that’s that’s who we go to. People like us but but that that knowledge is shared among all of us. You know, we don’t and if and if you’re an agent that doesn’t want to share, then yeah, you’re not we’re not sharing it back either, right?

Jason (46:44)
It’s

gonna be challenging. And

Linda Shepro (46:45)
So

Jason (46:45)
I’m happy that you you’re saying all this because really what I hear you saying this is you are not directly I don’t think you’re attempting to, but you’re basically making the argument for why relationships, connections, personal experience is still so valid in a day and time when there’s so much talk about, I can just go on to Chat GPT and figure it out. Because Chat GPT is just reading off of whatever’s been posted on the internet.

And doesn’t have access to the things that you and I are discussing right now. So I think it’s

Linda Shepro (47:16)
Right. And you

know what I I encourage people to do their research. I mean the worst thing for us is to have someone come to us and say, you don’t want to go somewhere. I don’t know where. but I wanna go for you for two weeks and here’s my budget. I mean, what do I do with that, right? I mean

Jason (47:28)
yeah. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (47:31)
you need some major counseling. I’m sorry, I I don’t I don’t do that. But but if you come to me and you’ve researched it on chat or

you know, any I AI service, you know a little bit more about it. You might be prepared for the prices. You might not. You might have old information. But please come to me with that and say, and then I can now I have a foundation for what you’re looking for and why. I can ask you why did you ask at this or what did you do, blah blah blah whatever. but you also find that a lot of their information is either dated

opinionated in some way. so y y you have to kind of wade through that and use your own experience here. The other thing that’s really big is I guess this this would be ol old school AI is ask your friend. You know, my friend’s

Jason (48:19)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (48:19)
been to Japan once.

Jason (48:21)
AI but if you don’t have any friends, AI is the next

second best bet, right?

Linda Shepro (48:24)
It i and they’re

gonna say, you have to stay here or you have

Jason (48:27)
Yeah.

Linda Shepro (48:28)
to do this or you’re like, Well no, maybe not, right? Yeah, yeah.

Jason (48:31)
yeah, I’m with ya. Yeah. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (48:33)
But but but I do tell people, you know, we’ve set we’ve said something and I know that they’re talking to people who’ve been to Botswana before, I’ll go, Talk to your friend about what what they did and what their favorite thing was and why. We’ll work we will work with that. That’s better

Jason (48:45)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (48:47)
than coming to me with nothing, right?

Jason (48:51)
I

think I think in both cases, whether it’s having a conversation with a friend or just Googling or or having a conversation with Chat GPT or whatever, it’s a ideation. It’s just get the juices flowing, get some kind of ideas so that you don’t reach out to every travel planner and say, I’ve always wanted to I’m gonna come

But I’ve always wanted to go here and I’ve got a week’s vacation in January. So let’s go. You know, they might be able to figure out that maybe January, I’m gonna say somebody, somebody’s gonna be like, no, Iceland is great in January. I’m not going to Iceland in January. So my point is just kind of getting the ideas going and enough

Linda Shepro (49:30)
Right.

Jason (49:31)
that, but I wouldn’t rely on it, you know, and then sit down with someone like yourself and

Here’s kinda what I’m thinking based on some conversations I was having. Help me help me, does it make sense and can you help me make it happen? Kinda that execution thing. You mentioned, you know, you gotta have people to execute things. So

Linda Shepro (49:47)
Right. Yep. And you have

to be very transparent about how much you know and how much you don’t know. because someone may come to me and say, Hey, my friend said this restaurant in Cape Town is phenomenal. Well, I don’t I don’t know, I’ve never been there. I need to find right? I I need to

Jason (50:01)
Yeah, yeah.

Linda Shepro (50:02)
find out. So yeah, bring bring me that stuff. I don’t know everything. And I’ll tell you what I don’t know too, you know. I’ll say

Jason (50:08)
Yeah, I love that.

Linda Shepro (50:09)
Do you like someone wants to go to Italy? I go, yeah, I’ve been to Italy twenty years ago. I might fly fly through there now and then, but I don’t I don’t know it anymore. I can tell you the regions and I can tell you the type of things you want to do in those regions, but I

Jason (50:22)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (50:23)
can’t tell you where to stay or who to call or whatever. So what I’ll say to people is I’ll refer you to someone that can help you. Do you want me to quarterback for you? And they often say yes, I want you to, because

Jason (50:31)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (50:34)
I want you to ask the questions that I might not ask.

Because they know. Yeah. Yeah.

Jason (50:37)
Which which makes perfect sense. It’s

I mean, you can’t expect everybody to know everything, but some people know the questions to ask. It’s like my my poor son, you know, I’ll like, Jackson,

you should why don’t you just call and ask them something? He’s trying to move into an apartment, trying to figure out, you know, things like renters insurance and this and that. And and I’ll say, Why don’t you call? ‘Cause he needs to call and then he calls and then he hangs up and I say, Well, why didn’t you ask him this? Well, why didn’t you ask him that? And he’s like

Dad. I I

Linda Shepro (51:06)
Yeah.

Jason (51:07)
didn’t know to ask that. That’s my point is we don’t always know what questions to ask. When we’ve got

Linda Shepro (51:12)
Exactly.

Jason (51:13)
a lot of experience doing something, we tend to just know what question to ask. We don’t even know why we know what questions to ask. It just seems like, well, you should ask this. So I g I get that. Hey, before we before we jump in, I because we’ve chatted a lot about kind of what you do, how you serve your clients and all that stuff. I definitely want to touch on how the heck did you get from where you were to where you are now.

And before I do that, because this is important to me, what part of this business do you like the most? Because there’s everything from, you know, scout, I’m gonna say just scouting destinations, familiarizing yourselves with destinations, marketing, planning, communication with clients, post-trip planning, all the different things that are out there. What’s the part that you enjoy the most?

Linda Shepro (51:59)
definitely the accounting. Just kidding.

Jason (52:01)
Said said no one ever on this show.

Linda Shepro (52:05)
I go, why didn’t he mention that? I

could spend days doing that stuff. my gosh.

Jason (52:10)
But wait, du I we’re gonna learn a little bit about your background, so it’s gonna it’s gonna come full circle again, but okay. So but also I guess that helps

Linda Shepro (52:17)
I think that the thing I enjoy

most about is the delivering someone’s dream and the creativity to make that happen. and it does take a a lot of creativity in working with them and the suppliers to to to make that logistically happen, economically happen and to create some magic along the way. So th that’s the most

fun part of this job is is to to really create something from nothing because we’re not taking an itinerary and selling it and selling it again. And when people want a sample itinerary from me, I might take someone else’s trip, but I have to preface it with why did we do what we did for this person? It might not be important for you. I’m not gonna repeat that trip. everything’s gonna be done custom, everything’s gonna be done creatively. But I can give you some ideas with with those type of things. So to me that is

the most fun part of the job. And then coming up with solutions that work and maybe maybe my supplier hasn’t come up with that solution. And then you know being able to to logistically make things work in a way that I know it’s gonna be a progressive trip that they’re gonna have a lot of wows. I mean that’s that’s really important.

wants me to book a hotel room for no, I’m not I’m not doing that. That’s that’s that’s that’s a waste of my time and my talent, right? I I I if you yeah,

Jason (53:38)
And boring, right?

Linda Shepro (53:40)
if you have Marriott points and you want to stay in Johannesburg at the Marriott, okay, I can I can build that into your trip, but that’s such a minor part of your trip, you know. I’m

Jason (53:50)
Does there so I I think dopamine is an important thing for most people. You know, all of us. We all need some. And I’m gonna use dopamine. If I were to chart your dopamine through the process of you know, i throughout the whole course of just I don’t know, of s several months. Where I’m going I know you’re like, Where are you going with this, Jason? I can’t wait to see. where’s the point when it hits you? ‘Cause I heard you say you like delivering on the

delivering their experience. I guess my point is what’s what’s the point where it really peaks for you? Because sometimes it could be I put together the proposal and send it over. I’m so excited. And other people might never really feel excited until they read the review after somebody comes home. What’s the point in the process that gets you the most excited and you feel like, okay, I’ve nailed it. I’ve knocked it out of the park.

Linda Shepro (54:39)
think when you deliver that proposal to someone and

Jason (54:42)
okay. Inter all right.

Linda Shepro (54:43)
and and you know that it fits what they’re looking for and

Maybe the price doesn’t fit, but it it ticked all the boxes and and now and now you go to that person and say, okay, let now let’s make this work. Like what do you want to change? What do you want to do? I don’t mind that part of it at all because that’s all part of delivery of the product. So

Jason (55:03)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (55:04)
you may have several iterations of you know what your first proposal is. But before that proposal is even made, we’ve spent enough time with that client to try to figure out what makes the most sense in with with within their budget.

Or if they don’t have a budget, that sometimes becomes a little difficult too, because yeah, I can put you in

Jason (55:23)
Yeah.

Linda Shepro (55:23)
all sorts of crazy places, but is it a value? Give me someone to work with.

Jason (55:26)
Give me something to work with.

Linda Shepro (55:30)
so so yeah, I think it’s the whole thing about putting the puzzle together, but that just doesn’t happen on the first pass. It’s it’s a whole creative process. I do love the part where we get everybody together before the trip and we answer all their questions.

and walk them through that and we’re able to say, hey, when you get off that airplane, you’re this is what you’re gonna see, this is who’s gonna be standing there with the sign on, this is what it says, blah, blah, blah. Here’s what the process is, here’s how long it’s gonna take.

This is this is what ha all of that type of stuff that that we can tell them those little hints. if you want to go to the ATM to get local currency, hey, there’s one on the right side of when you exit here or ask

Jason (56:10)
Nice, nice.

Linda Shepro (56:11)
your guide or whatever. So all of those little things that you are really the hand-holding things that really

Jason (56:16)
So you do that

Linda Shepro (56:17)
demonstrate I’ve been there, I’ve done it, I know what this is about.

Jason (56:19)
Right. You do that on a on a call,

a video, a group, everybody all the travelers together with the planner, or how do you do that?

Linda Shepro (56:25)
Well that’s funny, that

if it’s a big group, I tend to want to do both pre and post individually, like if I have a couple or if I have a family

Jason (56:34)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (56:35)
and then I have another family, I wanna do them separate because people are too shy to

Jason (56:38)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (56:39)
ask some questions in front of other people.

and other people have comments to make that they don’t want other people to hear. And same thing on the post. I tend to to to to take two by two or family by family and speak to them rather than as a group. However, if I do have a group, we do bring them all together after we’ve had those first pre trip

Jason (57:01)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (57:02)
talks. I bring them all together so that they can all meet each other if they haven’t, or they

Jason (57:07)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (57:08)
can all ask all questions together. So

Jason (57:10)
Yeah, that’s that’s very cruel. Very, very cool.

Linda Shepro (57:12)
yeah, so so it it all it all depends. And then you’ll have sometimes you’ll have families where

You know, maybe the adult children can’t can’t be on the call at the same time. We’ll record that and we’ll send it to them and we’ll say, here’s what we talked about, here’s the questions we answered, here’s the walkthrough of the trip. Do you have other questions? So now they’ve got a tool that that they can listen to on their their own. And we do a summary of the calls as well. We use AI to do that. The summary of the call, the summary of of everything. We keep all tracks of that so that we can kind of match what they told us. We’re not just writing it all down. We’re just we’re we’re we’re recording.

that and then the post reviews probably are they’re they’re fun they’re probably the least fun because we’ve already kind of tracked them we kind of know what’s happening and when they’re out there in the field the the DMCs are talking to us the suppliers are talking to us the guides are talking to us if they’ve got issues they’re talking you know we’re on WhatsApp

Jason (58:06)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (58:06)
we’re talking to them but what happens

on the I mean the great reviews are the great reviews and those are all fun, fun to hear and pat yourself on the back and all that, but you already knew that, right? You already knew they were gonna have a great time. So I I don’t get any extra kudos for that.

Jason (58:16)
Yep. Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (58:20)
But what what what happens is when they bring up something that they should have brought up when they were on the trip. And that’s an issue, right? And

Jason (58:27)
Yep. Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (58:29)
and and you tell time and time again,

Jason (58:31)
you’re saying that when you get to the review process, the you know, things come up that I I don’t know. I’m just guessing because I’ve been in that experience as well. It’s like, well, geez, you should have told me that three days ago. Or if especially if you’re following the progress, you know, they start out with maybe let’s just hypothetically speaking, they’ve got a trip leader or a guide or something that’s going to be with them the whole week. And then they get to the end of the week and they say, He called

me.

My name is Mary, but he called me Maria for a week

Linda Shepro (58:58)
Ha ha ha.

Jason (58:59)
and a half. Yeah, it’s

Linda Shepro (59:00)
It happens.

Jason (59:02)
just a random it random is that what you’re is that what kind of what you’re talking about though when it comes to the final review process?

Linda Shepro (59:07)
Yeah, things that you could easily fix

at at the time. That that become irritants, right? And you wish you knew about it ahead of time. Don’t tell me about it after the fact. Tell me when I can fix

it.

Jason (59:18)
We had people they they you know at one point I was managing this lodge offshore

Linda Shepro (59:21)
Yeah.

Jason (59:21)
and they you know get to the end of the week, well we didn’t you know, we didn’t have hot water all week. You guys should get hot water. I’m like if you would have told me that

Linda Shepro (59:29)
Really?

Jason (59:30)
the first day, I would have went over and relit the relit the hot water heater. We got to the point where I would get up every morning and just go look at all the hot water heaters to make sure they were all lit ’cause people would just wouldn’t say anything for three, four days. So yeah, yeah. So

Linda Shepro (59:43)
I don’t. Really, really, really

crazy.

Jason (59:46)
Anyway, we’ve discussed an awful lot about kind of what you do, how you serve your clients. Let’s go ahead and jump in. imagine this. Okay, you’re with a group, you’re sitting down at the dinner table that very first night, and they’re like, and you know the question, it’s Linda, how the F did you get into this? How like what are you doing here? What did you do before this? All this. So that’s where we’re gonna go with the conversation.

So what’s your typical response when someone says, Hey Linda, how did you get into this?

Linda Shepro (1:00:16)
I’d tell it’s a really long story they might not want to hear. No,

Jason (1:00:22)
And and

Jason, we’ve already been chatting for an hour, so but it but how far

Linda Shepro (1:00:25)
Alright.

Jason (1:00:26)
back do you want to go?

Linda Shepro (1:00:28)
Yeah, I think the first airplane I ever got on I was probably sixteen years old. Or no, yeah,

Jason (1:00:32)
Okay. Where were you living?

Linda Shepro (1:00:34)
even later than that, nineteen I think. I was in college and I went from Indiana to Los Angeles. That was my first airplane ever.

Jason (1:00:45)
What what

what took you to Los Angeles? Do you rem I mean, I’m sure you remember.

Linda Shepro (1:00:49)
you know, spring break. Spring break with

Jason (1:00:50)
Okay.

Linda Shepro (1:00:51)
a friend’s sister who was married to some Hollywood director. It was pretty funny. I mean I’d never I w I was pretty fascinated with Los Angeles. I was from Midwest. It’s a country kid.

Jason (1:01:01)
Yeah, yeah, I get that. Did you so did you grow up in Indiana then?

Linda Shepro (1:01:05)
yeah, I grew up in Indiana, yeah. you know, my parents did travel, I mean

Jason (1:01:07)
All right. What w what was that like? What w what were you into?

Linda Shepro (1:01:10)
but we you know, it was car travel, you know, put the

Jason (1:01:12)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (1:01:12)
kids in the car and drive to Michigan or d drive to Florida or or

So I mean I had some exposure to travel, but I probably really got interested in it and my husband and I started traveling quite a bit, you know, to to just see different parts of the world and when we had kids they were very interested in it. So I started doing trips for just our family and I’d consult certain people. I think one of the first ones I ever did was to Australia

and

We Bob and I lived in Chicago and there happened to be the tourism board of Australia was on our floor in our high-rise. So I went and talked

Jason (1:01:45)
Okay.

Linda Shepro (1:01:46)
to them and I was like, Hey, I want to go to Australia with my kids and you know, they were young and they gave me a couple ideas and you know, I booked booked a flight, booked a bo this is before Airbnb. They hooked me up with somebody that had a, you know, a place to rent, a private place, and we just explored on our own. I mean they gave me some names of people to take a sale.

Boat around the harbor, all of that type of stuff. So I started doing that a little bit. I decided I want to go to Brazil, same sort of thing. I asked a few people, got connected to somebody who could, you know, set up some hotels and stuff for me, but basically did it on our own. But it kind of became the Pied Piper. we wanted to go to Costa Rica and we wanted to go to Brazil and we wanted to go to

a all these places and and my kids, friends, families would go, I wanna go. And so pretty and I have twelve people and I’m like, okay, well you know, we’re gonna do this Yeah.

Jason (1:02:30)
Yeah. I see I see where this is I see where this is going

and I and I want to dig a little deeper on the front end part of it. When you were younger, growing up in the Midwest, you’re doing some v family road trips.

Is that the b is that a good word

Linda Shepro (1:02:47)
Yeah.

Jason (1:02:47)
to describe what you were doing? Okay. Do you remember the first time that or at any point during that time did the idea of international travel

Come up. I’ve heard people say things like I used to flip through national geographics, I used to this or that. Was there anything like that in your world? Were you even thinking about going outside the country?

Linda Shepro (1:03:06)
yeah, I was I always had a wonder less to go outside the country. My brother at the time that I think I went to Los Angeles joined the Peace Corps and he went to Micronesia and I went to visit him there.

Jason (1:03:16)
okay.

Linda Shepro (1:03:17)
So that that might have been one of my that could have been my first

Jason (1:03:20)
That sounds like

Linda Shepro (1:03:21)
I actually went to Japan to meet him and then I went to Micronesia later to see where he was actually living. So that was a a a long time ago. So those were probably the first times. But I never thought about getting into the travel.

business. I was I was out in the finance world, you know, I got a finance and accounting degree, went to work. Yeah. I

Jason (1:03:38)
Well that’s that’s what I wanted to ask. Is yeah, is

Linda Shepro (1:03:41)
went to work for Pricewaterhouse. I wanted to make money. I wanted to, you know, become a partner. I wouldn’t do all those things. I I it was all about the lifestyle that I was looking for after living in a small town. Yeah.

Jason (1:03:50)
But was it that was it that

way how early on in your li like when you’re a teenager do you remember like when did you start thinking, Man, I’m gonna go into finance and make a bunch of money?

Linda Shepro (1:04:01)
Probably the day I signed up for college, I decided to go to these

Jason (1:04:04)
Okay.

Linda Shepro (1:04:04)
classes. I think I I started at Purdue as an engineering student and I I switched to Indiana for reasons we don’t need to talk about.

Jason (1:04:13)
Okay.

Linda Shepro (1:04:14)
But and I was like, yeah, like my dad says, you should look at finance and accounting, you’ll always have a job there. And so I s I switched into that major and I got through school in just a couple of years, so I didn’t really have time to think about it, just get a job and get out in the world and go to a big city and that that was kind of my goal there. And then it was just became opportunistic.

Jason (1:04:31)
Did you have any f did you have any fun at

Did you have any fun as a teenager?

Linda Shepro (1:04:36)
yeah. I had great fun as a teenager. I was gonna be the first woman major league baseball player. You kidding? A league of their own.

Jason (1:04:41)
what? You

okay. very cool.

Linda Shepro (1:04:45)
Yeah, I grew up with brothers

and yeah, I was I was all about the athletics, but you know, I I was in a small town, we didn’t have athletics for girls, you know, cheerleading that was it. But I didn’t know my left for my right, so I didn’t do that. no, so I was always interested in that kind of stuff. And yeah, school was kinda easy for me, so yeah, it was it was fun. It was it was good good life. And then I went to Purdue in Indiana and

Jason (1:05:06)
But but if I’d asked ya Yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:05:09)
but but but is my career in

Finance was always opportunistic, you know. you know, how can I grow? How can I move? I got promoted to move from I was in South Bend, Indiana at the beginning, and I moved to Chicago after a couple years, and then I got recruited to do a a big project for the the partners in charge of the national office. And that’s where I started to travel a lot, at least in the United States, you know, travel all over visiting all these offices. And then I got a call by

lived in Florida at the time got a call from a family office, a recruiter, and became a CFO of a family office and was doing, you know, investing work and as well as being their CFO and helping them grow.

Jason (1:05:48)
What does a family what does a family office mean?

Linda Shepro (1:05:52)
Family office is

it’s really like an investment company. That’s that’s what this family was. So it was a family that was in their fourth generation of a pharmaceutical company and they had cashed out. They had sold their company, and so now you’ve got 27 family members with a billion dollars, and what are you gonna do with it? So, you know, they’ll organize as a as a really a financial institution. So we became involved in their investing and their venture capital and their private equity and all that kind of stuff. And then from there I moved to some MA.

jobs and and at the time my husband Bob he was starting a company and needed some help with someone that kinda understood the whole finance and partnership and and you know taxes and trading and all the stuff that we were doing that was pretty complicated back then. So I joined his company

right when we were having our first child and

And then we grew that into you know a bigger company that we eventually sold. But we hurt served these family office units and hedge funds and you know private administrators, etc. So it was it was a pretty robust career. You didn’t have time to think about anything else but growing that company and and then eventually selling that company. And then we dabbled in a few other things that were in the financial world. And when I moved to California from Chicago, I had a friend whose mom ran a

travel agency. She knew I was doing all these trips and she says, why are you doing this on your own? And you could make a commission and or you could get your trip free and I’m like, I only do it for myself. I only I only do it for myself and my friends and I do one or two a year. But she talked me into coming in and and at least just running my trips through her company. And

Jason (1:07:29)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (1:07:29)
along the way I met another person that was really well versed in Africa and

And I wanted to go to Africa, so I used that company to do you know, the the work for me. And that’s the company that eventually hired me as a brand ambassador. that’s the person who I eventually helped break out from that company on her own. And after a couple years of really understanding the business, I said, Hey, I can do this myself. I can figure it out. I and I had bigger interests than than

than my former partner did in where I wanted to be in the world and where I wanted to go and what kind of clients I wanted to serve. I didn’t want to just do the high, high end stuff. I wanted to to kind of broaden that. So we had a little bit different philosophy. But at that time I I knew ten years ago I knew enough. I knew enough to be able to say, hey I can go go on my own and do this. So i I retired several times and this is not something I’m gonna retire from. You know,

Jason (1:08:19)
Right. Linda, when Yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:08:25)
I retired from all sorts of

financial

jobs and you know landed here and this is where I’ll be. I I have a daughter that’s in the business, works for a different company. She works for an African company. my legacy will be to try to build this company for something for her to take over at the time she is ready. She’s ready now, but in my opinion, but she’s not ready in her opinion.

Jason (1:08:47)
Well, maybe she’ll watch this and it’ll inspire her. Lynn, it it’s interesting because when I asked you before, I said what part of the process do you enjoy most with this business? You kind of made a joke about the accounting. And and now we just learned about your finance background and and some of that stuff. Did it I w I need to walk me through the leap real quick from you told me what happened, but

In a sense, but like what was going through your head when you’d been doing all this finance stuff, you’d been successful in in these other businesses, kind of a a wheeler and dealer. I don’t know what type of word you would use to describe kind of what you were doing. That’s probably not a good one, but anyway, was there a point you’re like, okay, I’m done with this? I don’t want to do

this anymore. What what what is what was the transition like?

Linda Shepro (1:09:31)
it just became a necessity.

my partner and I were pretty successful early with her knowledge of the travel industry and and and the people she started introducing me to, there was just opportunities to go places and meet more people and pretty soon it just took more of my time. I thought I was gonna spend two days a week helping her out and being a part of it and learning the company and

it became pretty all consuming and at that time I was independently doing prom private equity work and I just said this is a lot more fun. It’s a lot more creative It’s a lot more fun. It’s

Jason (1:10:00)
Okay, that’s where I’m going. Okay.

Linda Shepro (1:10:04)
you’re d you’re I’m not trying to convince people to, you know, buy something from me. I’m trying to tell them how to use their money for their dream, right? Like

i i

Jason (1:10:15)
huh. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:10:17)
It it’s it was

Jason (1:10:17)
Did you

Linda Shepro (1:10:17)
just a whole different focus. you know, what product that you’re

delivery. And and hey, I like it myself. I’m very curious about the world. There’s a lot of places I still need to see and this lifestyle has afforded me the ability to do that. It’s also the lifestyle of being a travel advisor. I mean I’ll work I’ll work weekends, I’ll talk to you at night. hey, in the middle of the day I I have a lot of free time, you know, I can go to the gym. I can go to the golf course. I can go play pickleball. I can do all of the things in my life that

at this age are important to me, but yet still run a company because I can work early in the morning, I can work at night, I can work when a client wants me to, I can work on a weekend. So

Jason (1:10:57)
Right, right, right.

Linda Shepro (1:10:58)
that’s important. Lifestyle is very important. I mean when you’re working in big corporate finance and accounting jobs, you probably don’t have the freedom that I have come to to to enjoy.

Jason (1:11:08)
Well, I love

that that you got to that point. And you mentioned earlier you went to school, I think you made mentioned you made maybe started out as an engineer and you were told, Go into finance, money. I don’t know if the word accounting was used in that convert part of the conversation, but go into that because you can be successful, you can make a bunch of money, you’ll always have a job, you’ll always have success. So my question is, how has your definition of success changed from

Then when you’re like, this is a great idea, I’m gonna go work in finance, to what I just heard you say about, you know, lifestyle’s important, you know, the the flexibility to actually enjoy your life, helping people enjoy their lives instead of just how to make more money, make more money. So if you don’t mind, I’d love to hear it, you know, how would you describe your definition of success then

versus now?

Linda Shepro (1:12:01)
I think success

is I think we’ve been both my husband and I have been serial entrepreneurs, our whole lives. I mean we we had good backgrounds, you know, with like me with Price Waterhouse and and and A firms, etcetera. but for the most part we’ve had our own we’ve done our own thing, our own company, built our own

o own company. So being an entrepreneur is very, very important to me. Not only because I can kinda control the agenda, I can kinda control the outcome. but I can also ha have

Jason (1:12:30)
He’s being the boss sometimes, huh?

Linda Shepro (1:12:32)
my time. you know, th that I that I can also enjoy my life. And I mean, I could retire a long time ago. you know, we’ve been successful selling companies and and

But it i it it’s still fun to put the puzzle together. It’s still fun to meet other people, to hear other viewpoints, to see other culture. I wouldn’t be able to travel the level I do if I wasn’t doing this job. I mean I c I I could afford to do it, but it wouldn’t be the same.

Jason (1:13:01)
I think you probably could.

Linda Shepro (1:13:03)
But it wouldn’t be the same, inside information, right? I have inside information. I have

Jason (1:13:05)
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (1:13:08)
views into places that I wouldn’t typically ever have because of what I do.

So that to me is really important. And the new discoveries of of things because you’re constantly having conversations with our suppliers or the other agents that I know in this world about, hey, what’s new or that’s really cool or I I didn’t I didn’t know that you could go to Oman and have a good time, you know? I mean, all the things that y you learn from other people i is really important to me. And that’s helped me in my business too. I mean, it’s helped me

you know, look at it from different viewpoints of different people about what we’re delivering. So I think curiosity will w will keep me going and and and the love that I that I do have some, you know, inside tracks in into the great places in this world to to go.

Jason (1:13:56)
So if you’re having conversation with kids, grandkids, someone else, earlier in their journey, getting ready to go to school, trying to decide what to major in, can you imagine a scenario where you would give the same advice? Go into finance, go into banking,

go into this.

Linda Shepro (1:14:08)
So I told my daughter,

and she’s in trouble, I told her, go

Jason (1:14:11)
Okay.

Linda Shepro (1:14:11)
in the

She said

Jason (1:14:12)
Really?

Linda Shepro (1:14:12)
she got she got out of school and she was on a trip we had to Peru and she says, I wanna do this and I’m like, Well, go do it and learn as much as you can and then go back and work for the you know the the big companies and make big money and but you know what she found her way and travel and she makes enough to have a great lifestyle. But again, she had the background. She has the background for the the finance and the problem solving and the creativity

Jason (1:14:37)
Yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:14:37)
to put things together and she worked for a great company that

That had fantastic training when when she got out of school, she wanted to come work for me. I was starting my company and I was like, I don’t know anything. I don’t know, I can’t pay you. And but connected her to the right people, and yeah, she’s thriving. So I don’t know that I would give anybody advice to go in the hospitality industry or to do I don’t know if I’d do it any different, you know, because I

I don’t know. I I’ve learned what I’ve learned by living by living it, right? And being curious and experimenting with it. I mean I do have a lot of people that get referred to me that are looking for a job and and my advice to them is I don’t care what you studied in school, go work for one of the big companies, go work for one of the big guys. And they have the training staff and they have the you know the the the different departments that can help you and and and bring you along. You know, maybe you’ll decide that you want to be

in

marketing or you want to be in the their graphics area maybe you want to do their accounting or maybe you want to do their planning maybe you want to be a product or I don’t know. You those companies will give you the opportunities that I can’t give you. Because I’m small and I’ve done it myself. My my assistants are people who have been trained by those companies and then come work for me because they have a lifestyle now. They have a

Jason (1:15:53)
Yeah, yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:15:54)
they have ownership of the they ha they have they have more freedom.

And and also an ability, because I don’t have a big company with a lot of people, I have an ability to pay them well, you know, based on our success. So so yeah, my advice would be yeah, go to go to college, learn how to grow up and take w do whatever. Business this isn’t a finance, or always you can always have a job, so yeah.

Jason (1:16:16)
I wish I would have listened.

I had some people giving me advice like that back in the day. I wish I’d listened a little closer. Linda, this is we’ve we’ve covered a bunch of stuff. And I wanna be respectful of your time. I appreciate you sharing so much of yourself with our listeners. But before we wrap up, I wanna ask you, is there anything I forgot to ask you or any other topics that you want to touch on before we wrap up?

Linda Shepro (1:16:36)
no, I think I th I think the main thing I want to bring out is

You know, the value that we bring to a a a client is is really our knowledge and those connections and relationships. And we did talk about that a lot. But I think a lot of people think by going to someone like us, it’s gonna, you know, to Chang, it’s gonna, you know, raise the price of their trip. that’s not how it works. I mean, we negotiate with the suppliers. So if you went to that supplier directly, and most of the people we deal with in our in our world are business to business. They do not go to

consumers but you’ll have you’ll have companies out there that will market to consumers if you went to one of those companies you would be paying their retail price that’s not what they’re going to to do if I work with them because I’m handling all the communication all the issues all the problems whatever I am their sales and marketing team so therefore they’re gonna give me significant breaks on what the costs are so I’m small I’m not gonna have to write it up

To retail or whatever suggested out there. And again, most people we deal with are business to business, so there is no retail out there, right? But but we know, comparatively speaking, this camp to that camp to this hotel to that hotel, what those values are. So people don’t pay more, they often pay less. And we’re also making sure that that they’re getting the value they want or what they expect, right? Out of out of a trip. But if you’re just signing

for some some random

itinerary or you’re going to someone and you know, here’s how does that how do you know that that fits you? How do you know it fits exactly w what you wanna do or what you want to get out of it and create value for you. So I th I think that’s the important thing to know is and and and don’t go to someone who tells you they know everything in the world. Like, I know enough people that I could come to right. But I but but I’m not gonna tell you that that

Jason (1:18:24)
It’s a good clue right there that something’s not right. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:18:29)
that I can set up your trip to Germany. I’m

I’m I’m not gonna do that. And I’m g i I will give I will give you some connections and I will wish you the best. And come back and talk to me about something that I know something about.

Jason (1:18:43)
love it. So what I heard you say is whether you know the area the knot, you know you probably know somebody that does. your link is gonna be in the show notes obviously. So anybody that’s been listening to this, just click on a link and is there is it like right there book a call or what like what’s the button they should be looking for?

Linda Shepro (1:19:01)
You know what? almost all my clients are repeat clients or referral clients from them. So there’s no

Jason (1:19:07)
Okay.

Linda Shepro (1:19:08)
there’s no we we have a website that you know, we have all of our contact information and so people can find us that way.

Our our website is not to sell to n new people. You’re not gonna discover me among all the thousands and thousands of people out there. Maybe. But but but y but you’re gonna look at our website and it’s gonna show you the credibility. It’s gonna show you the knowledge,

Jason (1:19:22)
No, but somebody listening to this has just maybe discovered you. That’s the idea, I hope. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:19:31)
it’s gonna show you the places, it’s gonna tell you a little bit about what it’s gonna cost, w what are you gonna do in these places. It tells you a little bit about us. but it’s credibility more than anything. It’s not a sales tool. So so

Jason (1:19:40)
Yeah. Okay. Well, I I mentioned

I mentioned book a call just just because we discussed how important it was to get on a call. So it’s it’ not not in a sales type of way, book a book a anything. It’s just like I love and appreciate that you like to get on a call with people if you’re gonna discuss their trip. Yeah,

Linda Shepro (1:20:00)
It’s important. You have to do it. Yeah.

Jason (1:20:02)
it’s i it’s important and that’s what I was emphasizing there. So

Whether there’s a button or you however you reach out, it doesn’t matter. But I just I love that you’re so willing to to jump on a phone call or video call with people and discuss it because I think that’s huge. I think there’s a lot of tour operators out there or travel planners or all differ just companies in general that miss out on an opportunity to really serve people at a high level because there’s some hang ups about getting on a call, I guess. So what do you think?

Linda Shepro (1:20:30)
Yeah, you have to. There’s there’s no

there’s no way you can deliver a product or a a vacation, a journey without speaking to people. And spending time doing it too.

Jason (1:20:39)
I Yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:20:42)
And you know, I and I’m happy to connect people to the right people. I I you know, if I can’t do it for you, what is w what is that taking me? Ten minutes of my time? Yeah, it’s it’s it’s

Jason (1:20:51)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:20:52)
fine. You know, I I’ll r I’ll I’ll put you in in touch with the right people or tell you if I can’t do it or tell you, you know, maybe what your other options are, but that doesn’t take long.

Jason (1:21:03)
And just the fact ’cause ’cause you’re right, there there are definitely companies, people that pretty much I don’t want to say order takers. I’m not knocking anybody. There’s room for everybody that’s doing whatever they’re doing. But there’s definitely are people that just like, yeah, I’ve got a computer on my my desk that you want a resort hotel in Timbuktu, or do you want a you know, tickets bro show tickets or something, whatever I can do it all.

Linda Shepro (1:21:30)
Yeah.

Jason (1:21:31)
And and that’s fine. There’s you know, there’s places for everybody in this business, but I think it’s important to distinguish that that’s not what you’re doing. So Linda, yeah.

Linda Shepro (1:21:39)
No. And and we’re using

we’re using our destination management company to do those little things, right?

Jason (1:21:45)
Mm-hmm.

Linda Shepro (1:21:46)
But we’re there to say, Yeah, h here’s what the plan should look like, here’s the logistics, here’s what we need to make happen, then then we’ll work with someone that’ll make that happen. And if you have special requests, that’s who we go to, you know. Your show tickets, your hotel. I don’t

Jason (1:22:02)
Yeah, I’m not saying you can’t do

those things, but you know what I mean. Yeah. Ver

Linda Shepro (1:22:04)
Right, but but I don’t want we don’t want to. We want it to be all one one one big delivery. Yeah.

Jason (1:22:12)
very cool. Linda, thank you so much. I appreciate you taking so much of your time. super you know, I’m so fortunate to be able to have conversations with folks like yourself. And I know that our listeners really appreciate and learn from it as well. So let’s let’s do it again sometime. Thanks, Linda. I appreciate you. All right.

Linda Shepro (1:22:26)
Okay, sounds great.

Thank you for your time. I really appreciate it. It was a fun time. I don’t usually like talking about myself, but this is this is a a fun job to have and

Jason (1:22:37)
You did it you did a good job. You did a great job.

Thanks, Linda. We’ll talk to you soon. All right. Bye bye.

Linda Shepro (1:22:41)
Okay, thank you so much. Bye. Bye,

Jason.

 

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