Guest Bio
Per Jobs is the Founder and Managing Director of Fish Your Dream, a company dedicated to offering exclusive fishing experiences in some of Sweden’s most breathtaking and remote locations. With a background in jazz composition, Per found a unique way to merge his artistic creativity with his lifelong passion for nature and angling. Nearly two decades ago, he made the transition from a career in music to building a sustainable business centered around world-class fishing adventures. Under his leadership, Fish Your Dream has grown into a respected name in the fishing tourism industry, providing guided trips, high-quality accommodations, and immersive experiences for anglers of all skill levels. Through his work, Per has also championed conservation efforts, ensuring that the pristine environments where Fish Your Dream operates remain protected for future generations.
Show Summary
In this episode, Per Jobs shares the story of how he turned his love for both music and fishing into a thriving business. He discusses the challenges and rewards of establishing fishing lodges in remote locations and explains how he built Fish Your Dream into a brand that caters to both avid anglers and those looking for a peaceful retreat in nature. Per reflects on his transition from composing jazz music to designing fishing experiences and how his artistic background influences the way he curates unique trips. The conversation also delves into the sustainability efforts behind Fish Your Dream, including eco-friendly practices and conservation partnerships aimed at preserving Sweden’s pristine fishing environments. Whether you’re a passionate angler, an entrepreneur, or someone intrigued by the blend of art and nature, this episode offers valuable insights into the intersection of creativity, adventure, and business.
Key Takeaways
- ✓ Passion-Driven Career Shift – Transitioning from a music career to nature-based entrepreneurship.
- ✓ Integrating Art and Nature – Combining jazz composition skills with the operation of fishing lodges.
- ✓ Remote Tourism Challenges – Overcoming obstacles in establishing lodges in secluded areas.
- ✓ Sustainable Practices – Implementing eco-friendly methods in lodge operations.
- ✓ Client Experience – Crafting unique fishing adventures for guests.
What You’ll Find on Fish Your Dream’s Platform
- ✓ Exclusive Fishing Locations – Access to fishing in Ammarnäs, Tjuonajokk, Camp Onka, and Gotland.
- ✓ Guided Fishing Tours – Expert-led excursions tailored to various skill levels.
- ✓ Accommodation Options – Lodging available at each fishing location.
- ✓ Customized Packages – Personalized itineraries to suit individual preferences.
- ✓ Conservation Initiatives – Participation in programs supporting environmental sustainability.
Learn more about Fish Your Dream and connect with Per at:
https://fishyourdream.com/
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Podcast Transcript
This transcript is auto-generated on recording, and has not been edited by a human. It may contain lots of mistakes, crazy words, and stuff that makes no sense. The host and the guest are not responsible for the accuracy of the transcript.
Jason Elkins (00:01.703)
Hello everybody and welcome back to another episode of the Big World Made Small podcast for the adventure traveler. Big big episode today. Today we’ve got Per Jobs. He is super interesting. The kind of character hopefully by now you’ve come to expect here on the show. But with some pretty cool little twists. Per is the owner and CEO of Fish Your Dream in Scotland and I’ll let him kind of share a little bit more about what all that means.
Per, welcome to the show. Happy to have you here.
Per Jobs (00:32.962)
Thank you, great to be here and nice chatting with you. I have to just start with saying that Fisher Dream is not in Scotland, it’s in Sweden.
Jason Elkins (00:42.695)
Did I say Scotland? Did I really? Cause I was thinking Sweden. Well, then anybody that listens to this now knows that this is a completely unscripted conversation. I literally thought I said Sweden. I know you’re in Sweden. I’m not sure where I got Scotland. So thank you for correcting me.
Per Jobs (00:44.13)
You’re dead!
Per Jobs (00:49.357)
No problem.
Per Jobs (00:54.858)
except
Per Jobs (00:59.715)
What you should be mixing up is Sweden and Switzerland. That’s the common thing to mix up, you know.
Jason Elkins (01:05.339)
That would make more sense. I, yeah. So thank you. Thank you. I absolutely knew it’s Sweden and appreciate that. So on that note, tell us when I say you’re in Sweden, what does that mean? Cause it’s a big country. And you do a few different things there.
Per Jobs (01:08.27)
Yeah.
Per Jobs (01:17.302)
Yes.
Per Jobs (01:20.934)
Right now, yeah, I mean, we have actually a pretty harsh winter period in the whole of Sweden right now, which is quite unusual because it’s such a, you know, stretched out country from, you know, above the Arctic Circle down to more or less, not central Europe, but pretty big difference between south and north. So up north, we’ve had, you know, really, really strong
Jason Elkins (01:45.756)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (01:50.786)
cold the last weeks down to minus 45 Celsius and even down here where I am right now in southern Sweden in Gotland it’s an island in the Baltic Sea. We have a lot of snow and several degrees below Celsius so it’s that dark time of the year up north where we normally that’s where we have most of our operations up in Swedish Lapland.
And that place is, in this time, the sun doesn’t really hit the sky that much. So it’s a really dark period with a couple of hours of sunlight and then just a long night for a few.
Jason Elkins (02:25.883)
Ha ha!
Jason Elkins (02:32.527)
How much sunlight do you get in Gotland?
Per Jobs (02:35.246)
Here it’s pretty I mean we the Sun between probably nine and nine to five nine to four Probably kind of this time
Jason Elkins (02:44.323)
Okay, so still a little dark. So what do you do in the winter?
Per Jobs (02:48.81)
Actually, we do as the name of my company might suggest, we do fly fishing. But in the winter time, the lodges that we operate, that we might get into more later, is they are located in a place where there’s obviously fly fishing in just one of the seasons. But we do use these properties for other types of activities and tourism in the winter. But we put it in another brand.
because the fishing nerds and the ones that want to see some northern lights or experience Sami experiences or something, they will not be so encouraged by these graylings or trouts stuffed up your face. So we actually do a lot of other types of tours in the wintertime and we also use these seasons for logistical problems.
Because especially one of the lodges that we have is very remotely located. It’s in the middle of the Kiruna mountains. So you need to get there by helicopter. And bringing all the heavy supplies out there like, you know, diesel, gas and petrol and stuff. You don’t want to do that with a helicopter. So we do it in the wintertime with a snowmobile once we’re still operating a winter season up there. So it’s like a…
We still have to do that work in the wintertime, so we might as well also be open.
Jason Elkins (04:18.875)
Right, right. So pair what’s, um, so what I heard you say is really these winter operations are kind of operated under a different brand, but it’s, you’re not leasing out the places you’re actually still operating them.
Per Jobs (04:30.946)
We’re still operating it because it’s so important to, I mean, everything when we get there in the summer, we really have to have things prepped. So we really would prefer to rely on ourself to get everything right during the winter season. So it’s just turnkey system when we get there in the summer.
Jason Elkins (04:50.875)
Got it. Well, I’m super excited to speak more about the fishing and while we’re on the topic, I also want to, you know, let’s have an opportunity to discuss this winter stuff because I heard you say kind of Northern light stuff. What kind of stuff are you doing at the lodge besides getting it ready for the summer?
Per Jobs (05:09.674)
Yeah, part of the thing is that we have since in the winter time, it’s so much more accessible. So it becomes like I said, a different brand, because more local people and regional people can get there because everybody owns a snowmobile of their own. I mean, I think in this county, like one point, every citizen has 1.5 snowmobile. So even the kids. So they…
Jason Elkins (05:25.959)
Hmm
Jason Elkins (05:34.144)
Okay
Per Jobs (05:37.206)
they can travel the mountains more like we do with the car down in southern Sweden. So that sets the budget to a completely different place. So that’s one part of the clientele that we have there. Local people that come to enjoy just a good meal, sauna, hanging out, having a few beers, taking the snowmobile, going ice fishing. And then we are trying to move into another crowd.
which is more interested in kind of packaged activities. Because these people that are local, they know how to do all this stuff. They see the Northern Lights always. I mean, they don’t care. But if we package it in a way and go international, we can have, you know, reach another segment. The only thing is I have to segment when they come a little bit as well, because sometimes you don’t want to mix them
Jason Elkins (06:15.605)
Hehehehe
Per Jobs (06:36.182)
How shall I say? Reasons for coming. Reasons for coming, yes.
Jason Elkins (06:38.491)
Yeah, I’m gonna let you say that. How do you say that?
Jason Elkins (06:48.689)
I get that. Well, just different interests. They’re there for different things. They want to see different things. And…
Per Jobs (06:54.463)
So normally we have more of the of local people renting a cabin or a hotel room and having a dinner that’s in the weekends. So I try to get like international travelers getting there in the weekdays. So I have a combination because normally they are more flexible. They have a longer travel window, so to speak.
Jason Elkins (07:16.807)
So how would you describe that? You know, for anybody that’s listening to this that thinks, man, I might want to go to Sweden in the winter. Someone might be thinking that. Um, what does that look like when you say packaged activities? What are they, what are they doing?
Per Jobs (07:24.248)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (07:32.09)
They will probably fly into Kiruna and we take them by snowmobile over the mountains, out to the lodge and then we do all kinds of activities in daytime which could be like wildlife watching, check out some tracks, you could try snow shoes, ice fishing and more or less just enjoy these very remote locations.
where there’s no cell phone signal, there’s no light pollution. You know, it’s a bit of a… It takes a while for people to understand that there’s actually no cell phone signal. There’s actually no Wi-Fi. You know, they read it, but yeah, but there’s some where they’re still asking, is there anywhere I can check my emails? Well, no. We have a satellite connection for security and for our own business, but it’s not something
Jason Elkins (08:22.061)
Hahaha!
Per Jobs (08:27.682)
that is possible to use for the clients, for the guests.
Jason Elkins (08:33.511)
Have you seen clients show up out there with their own satellite phones? I know that, you know, in my travels every once in a while, I’ll come across somebody that has a satellite phone. Is that, yeah.
Per Jobs (08:41.346)
Yeah, they do sometimes. And it’s, you know, most people that come there, they come there to get rid of all the connections and so on, especially in the summertime and the comfort of fly fishing. So it’s when somebody’s running around with a satellite phone in the yard speaking, you can see the other people kind of, you know, side-eyeing this guy. So because…
Jason Elkins (09:05.591)
Yeah. All right. So anybody listening to this?
Per Jobs (09:09.462)
This is actually a selling point today to get to these places where you can’t get a connection because, you know, this, the pace of the community or the society today is so fast. So I think that’s going to be more and more important actually. But I know that we will have these internet free zones in the future. I mean, it’s all over. I mean, Starlink, it’s happening everywhere.
Jason Elkins (09:26.994)
Night.
Jason Elkins (09:36.811)
Yeah. I’ve had a few conversations with folks here on the, on the show.
about lodges that don’t have televisions in the rooms and don’t have wifi in the rooms. And I remember I managed to lodge in Belize for a while that it was kind of the same thing. We had wifi at the main lodge. So if you wanted to connect, you had to come to the main lodge and actually where everybody was and connect. You know, to get people out of their room. So I get that. So they maybe come over to the main lodge for the wifi. They check their emails real quick. And oh, by the way, you know, we’ve got a little bar there. We might be serving some drinks
some conversations and it was really a ploy to get people to connect I guess so which is which is important okay so you’re doing it so you’re still working in the winter obviously it sounds like you’ve got a lot of stuff going on in the winter do you have a down period of time at all during the course of the year
Per Jobs (10:25.182)
Yeah.
Per Jobs (10:29.862)
That’s a bit of the problem. I never get a real down period because we have four destinations right now and they are sort of linking together so that we will not have a down period. It’s good for cash flow but it’s sometimes a bit intense because we have fishing down south which happens in the spring and the fall and then up north it’s in the summer. That gives us a fishing season year around.
Jason Elkins (10:31.727)
I’m out.
Per Jobs (10:59.51)
from the beginning I started my fishing business, it’s almost 20 years ago now down here in the Baltic Sea for the Sea Run Browns. And my problem was that, you know, it’s pretty hard to get, you know, the good guides to stay with you when it’s only a season, short season. So I figured it would be just great if I could have a business also up north and maybe employ the guys year
Jason Elkins (11:19.986)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (11:29.366)
that then we assume they’re ready to move between the locations. But normally they’re trough bumps, you know, they, at least for a few years they can do that before they kind of grow up and want to settle down. But, uh, so that was the idea. And it actually worked that way. So for the first years I was just running the business down South and then I added this one lodge up North and this system started running and it was really effective, of course, because we could also do this cross.
marketing, I mean, the clients that we had down south wanted to try. The fishing up north, and then we expanded with some more destinations. So we now have four. And I mean, sometimes we have groups that come three times a year. I mean, it’s very good to have returning clients, but we can have them returning like three times a year sometimes. So, well, everything changed a little bit after COVID as for everyone, but. But.
Jason Elkins (12:18.32)
Wow.
Yeah.
Per Jobs (12:28.226)
The idea of these destinations feeding into each other has been working pretty nicely.
Jason Elkins (12:34.759)
So you’ve been doing this 20 years and.
Per Jobs (12:37.038)
No, no, I was exaggerating. It’s 18, 19 years, something like that.
Jason Elkins (12:41.691)
pretty close but thank you for being factual. It’s so and I heard you say you really don’t have any time off you’ve got it works great for cash flow you’ve got something going on pretty much all the time and
That can be kind of exhausting after a period of time. So I’m curious, do you have a plan in place that at some point in the future, you’ll be able to take some time off either by scheduling your business differently or hiring somebody that can… I mean, I’m sure you’ve got great people working for you, but I mean, how do you create time for yourself to take some time off and go explore and do other things?
Per Jobs (13:13.814)
Yeah, yeah.
Per Jobs (13:22.358)
I have been very lucky really early on when I was developing this business, I prioritized time over money still. So I early started to take help from other people to do all kinds of things. In the beginning, mailing and guiding, because in the beginning, of course, I did everything from running, doing the books to being in the water guiding. And so guide was the easy thing to employ at first. But I have always been pretty…
um, meticulous around having people around me so I can actually have time off, you know, um, and that, you know, in the same time making maybe a little less money, but rather that and have an easier, more enjoyable life situation.
Jason Elkins (14:04.196)
Hmm?
Jason Elkins (14:09.187)
life’s important and we jumped right into kind of what you’re doing and typically on the show I liked I really want to kind of connect with what you were doing before you got into this so let’s go back more than 18 or 19 years let’s go back as far back as you want to go I’m curious what were you doing what did your life look like before you were working in tourism and how did you make that transition?
Per Jobs (14:23.702)
Yes.
Per Jobs (14:37.086)
It’s actually, I mean, I’ve always had this interest for nature. Being in nature has been, you know, my big interest in doing different things, fishing and also hunting, you know, not anymore. I don’t hunt anymore, but I used to. But the other big track in my life has been music. So I’ve been…
playing music in different forms and also composing a lot of music. And I ended up doing a master of fine arts in composition. So I spent a lot of years and a lot of money studying music to then become a fishing guide. But you know, that’s how life is. But the transition actually was that I, after my studies, I moved, I was invited to move to this Island by a guy that I’d been started studying with and playing music with. And
Jason Elkins (15:18.971)
Yeah.
Per Jobs (15:30.39)
He said, we started up working together in music production and commercial production studio here on the island. And I also got a job as a band leader in the local theater here doing a musical and stuff. So that’s how I ended up here. But the real reason I wanted to go here was to go fishing because this place has a really nice fishing for sea run Browns. The transition actually happened. Something happened in…
Jason Elkins (15:54.524)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (15:58.846)
in the company where we worked, a big newspaper company bought the production company and our little thing run by two persons turned into like a very small part of the spreadsheet. It wasn’t as creative anymore and I think creativity is the key word here because it doesn’t really matter to me what I do as long as I do something creative.
Jason Elkins (16:17.127)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (16:28.846)
create something, you know, I can see a result in some way and it doesn’t really matter if I make music or Building a company or a website or a product or whatever But what happened was that when this Work situation wasn’t really that inspiring anymore. I had been thinking for years, you know about why isn’t anyone? Do it doing something with that the fishing?
here because it happens in the low season from a tourist point of view. There was a big summer tourism season here in this place because it has a lot of beaches and very interesting historical sites and so on. But the fishing season was when there was no one here so I figured there has to be a lot of you know infrastructure ready for taking care of tourists. And I did what probably wasn’t
done very much in Sweden at that time. I wanted to do, or I was actually asking, why is no one doing this? And in the end, I ended up doing it because I figured, okay, this is not fun anymore at my work, I will just try this. And I was inspired by mainly actually American outfitters and fishing travel agencies and stuff that put together the whole packages because that wasn’t really done in Sweden at this time, 2005 around.
So fishing tourism in Sweden meant that you went somewhere, bought a fishing license and maybe rented a boat. Nobody ever packaged fishing with a guide of food and transports and lodging and everything. So I figured that should work. You know, there was good fishing and it’s a nice place and people thought I was crazy, but I just quit my job and started.
Jason Elkins (18:01.37)
Mmm.
Jason Elkins (18:12.915)
Hehehe
Per Jobs (18:22.182)
embarked on that journey and for some weird reason it has worked so far. So yeah. Sorry? It’s the biggest island in Sweden. It has about 60,000 inhabitants and from the north tip to the south tip I think it’s about 180 kilometers.
Jason Elkins (18:30.475)
That’s very cool. How big is Gotland? Gotland is a very big city.
Jason Elkins (18:49.635)
Okay, okay, great. I appreciate that. And…
Per Jobs (18:54.672)
So it’s a large island for the Baltic Sea, but it’s not huge.
Jason Elkins (19:00.999)
So let’s talk a little bit about the actual fishing there. Cause you mentioned Sea Run Browns, you mentioned fly fishing. I’ve worked in the fly fishing industry for a long time and some of our listeners have probably not. So I’m gonna let you share a little bit about what is special about Sea Run.
Per Jobs (19:08.522)
Yes. Yep.
Jason Elkins (19:21.447)
Browns and what is why fly fishing? Just share something about that someone listening to this that maybe is not into fishing or hasn’t been fly fishing What would you like to share with them? Why do you do it? What’s what’s cool about it?
Per Jobs (19:36.622)
What’s cool about it? I mean, what’s cool about fly fishing is different, I think, in every destination, depending on the species and the environment. If we’re talking about the sea round browns here, it’s kind of, it’s not like fishing for bonefish in Cuba, but it is in the same time. I’m aware I’m now speaking out of, you know, the perspective of the person that doesn’t know anything about fly fishing. You asked me not to. That’s where I immediately went.
Jason Elkins (20:03.39)
That’s okay.
Per Jobs (20:05.578)
But I mean it’s cold, we are fishing in cold water and sometimes rough waves and things like that. It’s like surf fishing but the thing is it’s this magical environment, really beautiful shoreline. You’re wading on flats and you can actually sometimes see these trouts feeding in the surface and you can feed them, you know throw a fly to them.
and you get really in touch, you’re kind of, you’re emerged in the water. And, you know, that’s what I think the thing with all fishing and I fly fishing is in particular for me is that you get this concentration and focus and there’s not room for anything else like ruminating thoughts or, or thoughts about, you know, what you’re doing tomorrow. You’re just there in that moment and you become like a unity with, in this case.
Baltic Sea and the environment and the fish. You start to think like a fish and you… It’s like when you get into that groove, it’s kind of unbeatable. It’s like this flow state sort of.
Jason Elkins (21:16.343)
Allah
Yeah, I love the way you describe that. And one of the things I had written down that I wanted to ask you about was, you know, when we spoke last time was kind of, was actually meditation, you know, and Buddhist philosophy and meditation. And that’s exactly the way I think of fly fishing is if, if you’re fly fishing, it’s pretty difficult to really think about much of anything else. It’s really easy to just like, you know, whether you’re, whether you’re looking for fish or
Per Jobs (21:28.107)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (21:47.835)
got fish in front of you or you’re making casts it’s there’s your you know it’s a constant state of doing something as opposed to anybody that’s listening to this that’s been out on a boat trolling for example out in the ocean or on a lake where you just put out your bait and you’re just driving the boat waiting for something to happen there’s a lot of time to think about everything else or if you know you’re sitting on a bank and you throw out a piece of bait and you’re just sitting there waiting for your rod to bend over
about other stuff but with fly fishing there’s really not a lot of time to think about other stuff and every once in a while your mind might drift off but it doesn’t take long for it to come back kind of like with the meditation and I enjoy that. So the Sea Run Browns there on Gotland, it sounds like you’re fishing along the beaches not in the rivers. Are there rivers?
Per Jobs (22:20.578)
Yeah.
Per Jobs (22:29.839)
Yeah.
Per Jobs (22:43.182)
There are rivers of course they need to spawn which happens in the fall here but they are so small so it wouldn’t make any sense and it would put too much of a pressure. The only time they are in these rivers is for a very short spawning season and this spawning season is to be honest quite disturbed from many other outer factors.
business strategy is to always work a lot with conservation. And we have a problem with getting enough water into these rivers. We get to a little rainfall and there are other problems with irrigation and farming that takes away the water from all the wetlands. So there’s very little water in these streams. So we have to do everything we can to protect them. So that’s why the rules allow fishing for the browns is just in the sea.
Jason Elkins (23:39.675)
Okay. All right.
Per Jobs (23:40.438)
but it’s actually, it sounds in the beginning like you would be standing like with a toothpick in the Atlantic, you know, looking at the horizon. But in a while you start reading the structures on the floor of the ocean and, you know, seeing fish and you get into it and it’s very immersive.
Jason Elkins (24:03.603)
And that’s all done by waiting and walking the beach. Yeah, all right, that sounds cool. And how does, so how does that compare to some of the other fishing program? You know what, hold on, hold on. I don’t wanna go there yet because I have a few more questions about your, actually I wanna talk about your childhood. You said you always loved kind of fishing and you were into hunting. Where did that come from? Tell us a little bit about your childhood growing up. What?
Per Jobs (24:07.625)
Exactly.
Per Jobs (24:23.565)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (24:33.531)
What made that happen? Was it just because of where you grew up or were there other factors?
Per Jobs (24:38.602)
You know, probably that’s part of it, because I was not living in a city when I grew up. I was living in the countryside and I had a lot of people around me that would have as their main interest to go into nature for various purposes. My father took me into the forest a lot and also my mother’s husband took me many times for fishing and going into the woods and so on. So that was just a natural thing that you would do where I…
Not for everyone, but I mean, it was close at hand. You would be playing in the forest with your friends. Rather than on the field.
Jason Elkins (25:18.139)
Okay, and where was that? Where did you grow up?
Per Jobs (25:21.274)
I did grow up in the middle of Sweden in a place called Dalarna, and it’s like more or less a little bit south from the middle of Sweden. Lots of forests and a lot of quite vast nature at that time. The modern forestry is changing the landscape quite rapidly, but there’s still a lot of nice untouched nature there, but it was really an opportunity to grow up in that kind of environment.
that we did in the seventies. It looked quite different from now actually.
Jason Elkins (25:55.043)
Okay, so the people that grew up with you, if they were able, I’m sure some of them do know what you’re doing now, but I’m trying to imagine maybe some of the other people your age, some of the other kids, if they could look at you and see what you’re doing now with the fishing and the tourism. What do you think they would think? Is that like, oh, yeah, of course, or is it like, wow, he got the dream job? He’s how did he do that? What do you think they’re thinking?
Per Jobs (26:22.61)
What I get a lot is, wow, you got the dream job. I would change with you any day. But, you know, then I, you know, you just think to yourself, okay, do you know about all the long hours? Do you know about sitting behind a desk most of the time, not being at the water? You know, so it’s, of course, it’s, it’s a wonderful opportunity to go and fish in some of the best waters in Europe. You know, have that at your hands and being able to spend time there. But it doesn’t mean.
I mean, I am planning to spend a lot of time this summer up in the most remote lodge. And it’s awesome, but it means a lot of work. I mean, I’m going to be involved in the business there this summer, you know, hands on, which I haven’t been for some time. And that is a lot of work. It’s not like you’re on the water every day. Not a chance.
Jason Elkins (27:15.735)
So what’s the busiest, what’s the busiest three in 2024? What are the busiest three months for you? Like, or three month period, is it going to be this summer?
Per Jobs (27:24.327)
June, July, August, yeah.
Jason Elkins (27:26.131)
Okay, so June, July, August, how many hours a week do you think you’re working average?
Per Jobs (27:30.79)
It’s not a problem you can easily work between 15 and 18 hours per day.
Jason Elkins (27:35.939)
Yeah, yeah, that’s and I asked you that question suspecting you’d answer something like that. And I think that’s what’s important for people to listen to hear, you know, especially maybe.
Per Jobs (27:47.583)
On your hand, I mean it’s not like it’s not like I would switch it for something else. I mean sometimes I think oh it would be nice to have a kind of a normal job, grown-up job where you go in the morning to the office and you do some stuff and then you forget about it when you go home. But come on, you know I have done this very dynamic and flexible work situation for so many years. I don’t think I could just turn into such a…
Even though it sounds a bit tempting, you know, just go home and meditate.
Jason Elkins (28:20.832)
No, I get it. And I also envision like sometimes maybe your clients, you know, show up there and…
meet you for the first time and they’re looking at you like, wow, dream job, you know, basically what you were just describing. And they’re there on vacation and maybe they’re there with you for a week and they’re out fishing every day and sitting in the, you know, Jacuzzi or the sauna or whatever, whatever setting you have set up for them and looking at you thinking, man, you live this life every day. You’re out fishing every day and sitting in the sauna every day and, you know, drinking
with every day or whatever. I suspect it’s a little bit different. Is that the experience you have? Do you realize that sometimes your guests maybe aren’t completely in touch with what you’re doing?
Per Jobs (29:12.43)
Of course, they don’t know all the behind the scenes. I mean, if they sometimes, you know, when we do, you think of that sometimes when you’re doing this winter work, which is really hard, you go with the snowmobile and it’s super cold and you run off the track and the whole, you know, whatever cargo you have goes into the snow and you have to redo it and everything is just living hell. And that’s all to prepare for these few weeks in the summer.
when these people are coming. There’s so much work to get that to actually, you know, function perfectly when they’re there in the summer. They have no idea. So it’s part of the show. It’s like, yeah, we do this, it’s easy. You know, it’s, I think they like that image of the crew or as you say, me as some sort of, you know, this guy has it all, so to speak. It’s part of the deal.
Jason Elkins (29:50.871)
Yeah, yeah, it’s um
Per Jobs (30:09.89)
For me, the most enjoyable thing is when they are really having the time of their life. I mean, that’s the best. That’s better.
Jason Elkins (30:19.951)
It’s kind of cool because it’s a reflection that you did exactly what you’re trying to do. You worked your ass off to create a situation where they could come, you know, fly into your lodge and. Enjoy themselves and not think about how did the gas, the petrol get here for the boats, how did the food get here, how did the, you know, all these things? Because you don’t want them thinking about that, that’s because that reminds them of their own struggles and challenges back home. And and.
It’s, you know, I’ve been with tour operators, I’ve been with lodge owners that.
really like to spend a lot of time sharing how difficult and how hard they worked to make all this available for you and it’s just not fun to be honest with you it’s just not fun to listen to them talk about how hard their life is to make all this happen for you it’s hard to sit there and enjoy it when you almost feel guilty like oh man i was gonna have another shot of vodka but now that i realize you brought it out behind a snowmobile three months ago maybe i won’t
Per Jobs (31:11.864)
I’m sorry.
Per Jobs (31:24.885)
Exactly. Yeah. That’s part of the show. Yeah.
Jason Elkins (31:25.958)
Yeah, I get that. That’s pretty cool. And okay, so you described kind of your childhood growing up and doing some of this outdoor stuff. And I really want to touch on the music stuff again, because how did the music enter your life?
Per Jobs (31:36.663)
Hmm?
Per Jobs (31:41.922)
Well, it was there from the beginning. A lot of people around me, they were playing instruments. They were playing mainly folk music, like the local variant of fiddle music that is common in Sweden. So I had that around me, you know, since I was born. I more or less, or each other night, I fell asleep to the sound of people playing somewhere in the house, you know. So that’s childhood memories of falling to sleep.
Jason Elkins (32:05.945)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (32:10.882)
falling asleep to the sound of this kind of music. So it was with me from the beginning and I started singing in the church choir and all that stuff and playing different instruments. And then I started taking, it was mostly the piano that I played more seriously and studied jazz piano and got into that and started writing music. So that’s how I ended up in this.
in the Royal Academy of Music in Stockholm to study big band music actually. I wrote stuff for a big band. Yeah. So I got a scholarship to go to New York to hang in all the clubs. And I spent time with one of the contemporary jazz big band composers at the time, which still is, she’s still a name. I just came to think of it because I’m talking to someone from the States. So that’s…
Jason Elkins (32:47.005)
Wow.
Jason Elkins (32:51.059)
It’s really cool.
Per Jobs (33:10.794)
That’s what I mean. I was there at the time and then this huge shift came along and yeah.
Jason Elkins (33:19.315)
It’s very cool. It’s one of the interesting things about, I think tour operators, but specifically kind of more of the adventure tour operators than I consider for me adventure travel, adventure tours has to do with just things.
kind of outside of the comfort zone, just a little different, whether that’s, you know, fly fishing, even sometimes cultural, you know, foodie type of tours where you’re getting out and really connecting with people as opposed to being on a big cruise ship or at a resort hotel. But so when I say, you know, specifically adventure tour operators that I’ve spoken with, they’re usually kind of, I guess I want to say an eclectic.
type of group of people, you know, it’s a surprising number of them, you know, have varied interests like music or theater. I was a theater major in college, you know, first time I was theater and vocal music. I was there on a theater and vocal music scholarship and, you know, and then was a fishing guide like yourself. So, I mean, I’m not, it’s, but it’s, and I think it’s just
Per Jobs (34:21.655)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (34:27.219)
comes down to the curiosity. I think that artistic and creative people just tend to be curious people. And I think that adventure travelers, I’m going to start with adventure travelers, are curious.
Per Jobs (34:29.55)
Hmm.
Jason Elkins (34:40.859)
They want to see things, experience things, and they’re just open to the world. And then that same type of person is the same type of person that becomes a tour operator. Because they’re curious, they want to learn about the world, and then they tend, curious people tend to want to share what they’ve learned with other curious people. And then you’ve got a guide, or a tour operator. And I think that’s, I think that’s, that’s pretty cool. What do you think?
Per Jobs (34:58.774)
Yep. Mm. Yeah.
Per Jobs (35:07.766)
Yeah, that really makes sense. And in Sweden, and I don’t know, maybe elsewhere as well, but I have seen a very unlikely high connection between jazz musicians and fly fishing. It’s a thing, you know? So what you say is that whole being in the moment kind of improv, being immersed, and also the fly fishing has this…
Jason Elkins (35:22.787)
Yeah.
Per Jobs (35:35.69)
I wouldn’t say theoretical, but philosophical side to it. You have to, you know, you also have to learn a lot of stuff about, you know, the insects, the life cycle of different insects and learn to read the water. There’s so much stuff around it that you need to know what is something about before you can hit the zone with this, you know, this unity with the fishing experience.
Jason Elkins (35:56.912)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (36:00.995)
I think if you’re not a curious person, I think fly fishing would be a really miserable sport for someone that’s not curious. You know, because there’s so much to learn and to think about, which is of course what keeps you in the present and you’re not thinking about work because there’s so much going on. And music’s the same way. I would, you know, to me, you know, I think…
Per Jobs (36:09.42)
Exactly.
Per Jobs (36:23.478)
Yeah, you have to be on the spot in the time, in the moment, you know, creating with other people. It’s the same kind of thing. And about the curiosity, I mean, my own fly fishing travel has taken me to places I would never have seen. And I’ve met people I would never have met without the reason of fly fishing. So sometimes what you take with you, what you take home from a trip, it’s not necessarily that big.
fish that you caught somewhere, it’s more likely it’s an encounter or a place or a culture or something else. That’s what you tell your kids about later or think about 10 years later. It’s not the big grayling or bonefish.
Jason Elkins (37:10.255)
Yeah, it’s something else. The person you connected with, maybe it’s the guide you connected with. Maybe it’s your child. Maybe your child traveled with you or a parent or…
Per Jobs (37:20.172)
Or the guy that won’t let you leave the restaurant without you buying his private lobsters that he has in a freezer for our cloud mountain trip. You know that kind of stuff that’s what you remember.
Jason Elkins (37:30.971)
Yeah, yeah.
Jason Elkins (37:36.345)
Uh huh.
Jason Elkins (37:39.915)
It reminds me of someone and I don’t know if it was someone wrote this, but I remember when I was in Montana guiding trout in Montana, it came up. It was something about, you know, we like to trout. We like to trout fish because trout live in beautiful places. You know, it’s like, yeah, that’s it’s a really good excuse to go see some really cool places. I’ve seen some amazing things.
Per Jobs (37:59.273)
Yeah.
Jason Elkins (38:08.339)
that started out in Quest for Trout, but then became something so much bigger and so much deeper.
Per Jobs (38:15.33)
Yeah. And in this day and age, we can really use, for example, the trout as an indicator, as a measurement of the quality of the nature or the water there, you know, because they won’t be there if it’s polluted or if it’s, you know, so we have to look at these creatures from that perspective as well. And that’s also what I think, you know, what’s inspiring me is to sort of educate in the same time. We have a
All our clients are with guests. No, sorry. All our guests are with guides all the time. And, you know, most anglers think that they know, you know, everything from how to handle fish and how to fight fish without, you know, damaging them and, you know, about the ecology and stuff. But, you know, there’s so much more to learn. And, and if you can get your guests to, to learn a little bit more.
Jason Elkins (38:48.807)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (39:10.946)
be it about the ecosystem or the local Sami community, they will be more likely to protect the stuff that they know and care about the stuff, you know, the stuff that we don’t know about, we don’t care about. And that’s sadly enough what happens with fish a lot, because it’s under the surface. We have no idea what happens to the sharks when, you know, they get finned by the thousands or whatever.
Jason Elkins (39:33.79)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (39:36.282)
as soon as we know we start to care and that’s some like a little small mission that you can work with each person to Open them up to something new that they didn’t know before
Jason Elkins (39:48.911)
And I think that’s the case for a lot of tourism. Everything from going to see a rhinoceros in Africa to catching a sea run brown in Sweden to seeing manatees in the Caribbean or whatever. If we don’t see those things, if we aren’t interested in those things, then…
We just don’t care, unfortunately. It just kind of sucks. But yeah, I think I mean, that’s fly fishing has done tremendous things to help conservation in many places in the world because the fly fishermen are like, no, this is important to me. It’s important to me. It’s important to us. It’s important to the community to protect these rivers and.
protecting the rivers, they keep the fish in them and that keeps the tourists coming and the dollars and it’s all connected.
Per Jobs (40:48.758)
Yeah, I think it’s for us, it’s very important to push the boundaries there, you know, so we really have the best available knowledge about these things. And so, for example, we did a cooperation with a local university, or it’s one of the oldest universities in Sweden, actually, that around this Seabron Browns. So we had them, scientists join us fishing with.
both with clients and with guides and take blood samples just before we release the fish and check other markers on the fish as well to see how they react on the catch and release process in different circumstances, temperature, what sex is the fish and so on. Catch and release, most people would know, we release 99% of the fish more or less.
Jason Elkins (41:30.652)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (41:44.334)
because people don’t want to kill them. That’s not the point, at least not in our, the people that come to us. But I mean, we’re pushing the boundaries here to the point where someone says, well, maybe you shouldn’t investigate that because maybe you’ll find out that there is really an ethical problem with releasing the fish. But we figured we really wanna know what we’re doing, making money from, there must be some sort of suffering involved. There’s no denying.
Jason Elkins (42:13.307)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (42:13.314)
So we really need to do our best to see how we do it and how does it affect the fish. Anyway, these studies have shown that there’s a super high survivability and they revive you know to a very high percentage if handled right.
Jason Elkins (42:31.043)
I think that’s super interesting and important and I’m also aware of other studies where they’ve looked at the value of fish in relation to the tourism dollars that they bring in. And I don’t remember the numbers but I think it was maybe the Bahamas or Belize that looked at bonefish.
Decide came up with this number that you know a bonefish was worth a thousand dollars I don’t remember the deal the deal but the bonefish was worth a thousand dollars because you look at all the tourism dollars that come in as a result of You know Fishermen that are coming in catch and release again and as opposed to you know
you know, basically a justification for the protection of these species as opposed to setting out nets. So the local fishermen could net the bonefish and sell them in the market for $3. They could say, look, this bonefish is worth $1,000. So it’s I think that a lot of those studies are quite interesting.
Per Jobs (43:30.058)
Yeah, I think it’s important that you do them, even though they might kind of miscredit you. I mean, we’re working with living creatures here. And so that’s a huge responsibility that comes around this to do it really responsibly.
Jason Elkins (43:48.075)
Yeah, yeah. And I think this ties in well to the conversation last time you and I spoke, we spoke a little bit about kind of the indigenous people that you are partnering with, because speaking about living entities and…
impact of tourism and conservation and sustainability. This is a big part of the conversation. So tell us a little bit about kind of what you’re doing with the indigenous peoples there in Sweden.
Per Jobs (44:17.846)
It looks a little bit different in the different areas where we are active, but there’s one special, you know, that’s one place that has some special interest around it right now. In Sweden there has been one of the Sami communities where our lodge is, one of our lodges is located. This community, they did a law lawsuit against the Swedish government for stealing their hunting and fishing rights.
and they know nobody thought this would lead anywhere but it was a nine year process and it there is now a high court verdict that the summer community was right so this quite you know you know in numbers small group got all the fishing and hunting rights for a very large chunk of land so this has been a political and it’s been to be honest a shit storm
because there’s so much conflict that has been growing around this because all of a sudden only the people, the local people there could access these huge areas and there is some sort of, you know, nobody knows what will happen if this, since it’s a high court verdict it might spread in the whole country for all the Sámi communities and that would cover, you know, a big part of the Swedish land mass.
So that’s a very important verdict that will change the game completely for hunting and fishing in Sweden. So we were in this pioneer area where we of course, when this high court verdict came, we didn’t have any fishing rights. So we had a lodge with, you know, sold rods and everything and no fishing.
Per Jobs (46:12.654)
We found in our talks with the Sami community, we found a way of doing a really nice agreement that lets us stay there in a way that benefits nature more than it did before. And we can connect more with the Sami community. And they get some more money out of this. And they, mainly what they want is conservation. Less people in the mountain hunting, fishing, less helicopters, less, you know, stuff going on.
Jason Elkins (46:35.322)
Hmm.
Per Jobs (46:42.282)
And to be honest, in the Swedish mountains, there are areas that have become really polluted and where people don’t really behave. In Sweden, we have this freedom, what’s it called, freedom to roam, so to speak. You have public access everywhere. And there’s a backside to that. It worked better before when there was mostly Swedish people that grew up in the kind of
local area and know how to behave. But we have other, you know, there’s more tourism and the uncontrolled tourism will bring these problems up more and more. And I think this is one example of what will happen in the future if we don’t organize the tourism better and more.
Jason Elkins (47:33.651)
Right. Well, it sounds like in a sense what happened is the court ruling gave the Sami community the ability to decide how they want to manage the resource. It wasn’t so much that they are the only ones that can use it. You have to be Sami in order to catch a fish. It’s that, hey, they now have the ability to decide who do we want to partner with? What sort of limitations do we want to put on the use?
Per Jobs (47:45.315)
Exactly.
Jason Elkins (48:02.599)
catch rate stuff like that is that is that the case? Okay.
Per Jobs (48:05.534)
Yeah, exactly. In our case, they leave most of the kind of details around fishing rules and catch rates and stuff to us. But the main thing is we get this beautiful stretch of river and we know that we have this resource and we know, you know, we can set the rules to keep the quality in place. And then there’s always a debate, you know, public waters versus private waters. It’s probably big.
where you are as well, but we have, I mean, there are so many miles of, of running rivers in Sweden. And I think it’s this really an opportunity in keeping zones where this, you know, this zone here is really suitable for, for this touristic kind of business that we are doing. And that’ll benefit, you know, most people the most, you know, in certain areas.
Jason Elkins (49:01.043)
Great. All right, very cool.
Per Jobs (49:03.882)
You know, you should look at it at that. I think they have, I don’t know if you know about the term, maximum sustainable yield.
Jason Elkins (49:12.112)
Mm-hmm.
Per Jobs (49:13.462)
You know, how much fish can you take out of a population before it collapses? That’s how you look. Maybe you should manage fish with like, you know, maximum societal yield or something. You know, how do we use this resource in really the best way and not just looking at how do we manage it to not deplete it and make cat food and food out of it, like you said.
Jason Elkins (49:41.967)
Yeah, yeah, it’s interesting stuff. And I also want to take advantage of the opportunity while I’ve got you here to help our listeners learn a little bit more about Sweden.
Because we’re talking about the Sami people. I don’t know anything about them, honestly, other than brief conversation I had with you before we got on this call and the conversation we’re having here. So what would you like people to know about the indigenous peoples of Sweden? Just kind of an overview. So the next time they hear the term Sami, they have some clue what that’s all about.
Per Jobs (50:16.242)
The best thing would be if somebody that was actually a Sami would tell that story, but of course, I mean, I think I can do the job here and now. I mean, they are reindeer herders, and they were up in northern Sweden, you know, way before there were any Swedish people, and they consider their country, it’s called Sápmi, and it goes, it includes Norway.
Northern Norway, Northern Sweden, Northern Finland and part of Russia, because it’s the same kind of nomadic people that follow the reindeer. Today, of course, it’s more mechanized, but there are still reindeer herders, many of them. And they are… These indigenous people, they are like other indigenous, they live really close to nature, in harmony with nature. They have a really…
a long-term perspective on the lands, on how to manage nature. And I mean, like when you’re a Swedish businessman, you might want to, if you ask them, can we do this? What do you think about, we could do this? And you think it takes a long time to get a reply. Then you have to keep in mind that they kind of think, you know, how will this decision affect
five generations from now. And that’s, you know, we should have more of that in our own business models or strategies. I mean, we don’t think more than five years, I think. Normally.
Jason Elkins (51:44.657)
Right.
Jason Elkins (51:55.235)
Yeah, yeah. So I’m curious, if you described everything you just described about them, about the Sami people, but didn’t use the word Sami, the word I would come up with is Laplanders. And I don’t know anything about that term. I’ve just heard it. I suspect there’s other people out there. What is the difference between Lapland?
Per Jobs (52:17.874)
I think what you would probably mean with that word is a Sami person. That’s what I think. I don’t think it would be very appreciated. Lapland is also Swedish. We talk about Swedish Lapland. It’s actually just a geographical region, a decision. So technically anyone living in this area would be a Laplander. But I still think that I at least
Jason Elkins (52:23.373)
Okay.
Jason Elkins (52:43.283)
Okay.
Per Jobs (52:46.198)
in my mind make the connection between the Sami and the laplander because I’ve seen the naked gun and they make a joke about a laplander cutting this Frank Drebben’s balls off. So I have an idea that Americans think that…
Jason Elkins (53:02.051)
I did not see that episode. I didn’t see that movie. Well, maybe I did, but I don’t remember that. I just literally, I just think of up north when you say reindeer herders, northern that part of the world, I think of, okay, is that region called Lapland? Would that be Laplanders?
Per Jobs (53:18.892)
Yes, you’re touching upon it. And so they follow, the reindeers are up in the mountains in the summer for grazing, and then in the winter they go down towards the sea. So it looks a little bit different in the different parts of this northern region, you know, where and how the reindeers move, but traditionally the Sami have been travelling with the reindeer between the mountains and the coast. So this place where we have a lodge called Chonajok,
It’s actually a summer place for the Sami when they were there with the rain there in the summer. So I’ve actually met people that are born out there in this really remote location. It’s not that far.
Jason Elkins (54:02.419)
Yeah. Now, are your guests able to engage with the local people?
Jason Elkins (54:13.635)
I don’t even know how to ask the question. I’m just trying to get a feel for like how much opportunity your clients have to engage with the Sami people and maybe see some of these cool things that you just wouldn’t see elsewhere.
Per Jobs (54:15.996)
Yeah.
Per Jobs (54:26.326)
You know, it’s different between the lodges. One of the lodges we have is in a village where you can actually arrive by car and there are Sami people living there and Swedish people. And there we do offer outings with Sami to learn about Sami culture and Sami lifestyle and religion and so on. We have multi-day tours where you join Sami families to see how they live their lives and just…
join them for fishing or preparing a meal or you know sitting in the in the tipi or gotis that it’s called in Sabmi and or hiking you know collecting herbs whatever. So yes in that place you can really interact and hear the storytelling from these people. They are people of storytelling of course like many nature you know peoples they have an
you know, reading and writing came later. And so there’s a possibility and it’s a good chance to learn because, I mean, these minorities have been, you know, kind of harshly, been treated very harshly also here, just like in many other places. I mean, the Swedish government forced a lot of people to move down south because it was too many reindeer up north, ideas like this. There has been, you know, right on racism going on. And there’s still traces of that.
going on. So that’s probably why this, I mean, in the end triggered this lawsuit, you know, you know, getting something back that they feel was stolen.
Jason Elkins (55:55.203)
Yeah, yeah, I see.
Jason Elkins (56:08.655)
You know, and I think many, many countries in this world could face the same type of situation in court, maybe, you know, with talking about, I mean, just what you described, I could see that happening in Canada, the US, Australia, New Zealand, so many places after all over Africa. And it’s
That’s also part of what makes it interesting because there’s a lot of ramifications there in Sweden, but potentially also big ramifications throughout the rest of the world and community.
Per Jobs (56:41.446)
I think so. It’s very interesting. And that’s, you know, even though initially it posed a threat on my existence, on my business, I think it’s still so interesting in, you know, being in pioneering these things. It’s interesting to see what happens. And, and it’s also interesting to that’s, that’s part of, you know, the adventure travel to, to solve problems, you know, that’s, that’s part of adventure travel, right? If it’s goes just smooth and perfect.
Jason Elkins (56:58.247)
Mm-hmm.
Jason Elkins (57:06.459)
Right.
Per Jobs (57:10.25)
you know, get on the bus here and, and get off here to see the statue and then go home. I mean, what’s exactly. So you need these little challenges, at least as a business owner. I think it’s, you know, making connections and making, trying to understand each other. You know, that’s the different cultures trying to understand the other part.
Jason Elkins (57:15.027)
That’d be so boring. Yeah.
Jason Elkins (57:34.951)
Well, and that goes back to earlier in the conversation, we used the word creativity, whether that’s in music or business or creative solutions, curiosity about understanding other cultures and figuring out different ways that we can make this work in a way that benefits everybody. So I get it, I get why you’re excited about this stuff. So very cool. We discussed a lot of, go ahead.
Per Jobs (57:59.243)
Also, you grow up also. I mean in the beginning you just want to fish and then you become an adult and you kind of want to discover other things.
Jason Elkins (58:07.034)
I’m out.
Jason Elkins (58:12.943)
Yeah, I can relate to that. I started, I was fishing guide in my 20s and managing fishing lodges and working for Orvis in my 20s and early 30s. And I got to the point where it’s like, you know, I’m actually frankly much more interested in the general adventure tourism space as opposed to just the fishing. So like listening to you describe.
your lodge up north with the Sami people and really, like I could probably go there for a week and never touch a fly rod and be totally happy just to explore and see, maybe watch other people fish and just take in things because that can be a challenge with fishing is like we discussed earlier, it can be very focused. Sometimes you miss things around you. So, but that’s for each person to figure out on their own and decide how they wanna.
Per Jobs (58:43.446)
Yeah. Yep.
Per Jobs (58:55.955)
No. Yeah.
Jason Elkins (59:03.739)
how they want to deal with that when it comes up. But, um, pair, we’ve had a great conversation, covered a lot of things. I have a feeling we could probably do two or three episodes, but on this particular episode, I want to, I want to know what did I forget to ask you? What, what should I have asked you? Or what do you want to make sure that our listeners here before we wrap this up?
Per Jobs (59:22.882)
I don’t really have anything. I was just hoping to have a good conversation, I think we did. So yeah, so I feel happy. Or just reach out if you have questions.
Jason Elkins (59:29.607)
How did we do? I think so too. Thank you. Ha ha.
Jason Elkins (59:37.283)
All right, very cool. Hey, one thing I do want to mention real quick. The last time we spoke a few weeks ago and you sent me over a video from YouTube where someone had done kind of a little feature piece on you and your business. And I mentioned to you that I watched that with my son and just thought it was really, really well done. And I know this is a podcast, but I want to mention that. Is that something you have linked on your website? If someone were to go to your website, would they be able to find that video?
Per Jobs (01:00:03.423)
I don’t think…
Per Jobs (01:00:06.947)
Not right now, but I mean it’s easy. I actually had that suggested to me the other day that it should be there, so maybe I should put it there.
Jason Elkins (01:00:13.915)
Okay, well, let me share with you what I was thinking. And the reason I wanted to bring this up for our listeners, anybody that’s interested in Per’s interesting story and just Sweden and just this stuff we’re discussing, I would highly encourage you to click the link in the show notes that’ll take you directly to Per’s website. And maybe by the time you’re listening to this, he will have it linked on his website, but here’s the thing, even if he doesn’t.
The link to his website is in the show notes. Obviously you’ve got his name. If you go to YouTube and you type in, I’m sure if they type in your name into YouTube, they’re gonna find it. They go to your website, they can figure it out. It was just a really, really cool little thing that they’d put together. So I wanted to mention that for the listeners because I think they’d enjoy it.
Per Jobs (01:01:02.728)
It’s a beautiful place. It’s made by Swedish Lapland. It’s like a destination management organization up there and they wanted to do something around me and the music and the business. So it’s all my music so it’s pretty cool.
Jason Elkins (01:01:13.487)
Yes.
Yeah, no, it was very cool and I’ve seen a lot of travel videos and a lot of travel type related stuff in years and that was really different. I thought it was really cool so I wanted to mention that for anybody that might be interested. So alright, well yeah, thank you. I appreciate you taking time to chat with us and I look forward to working on some projects with you in the future and hopefully visiting you there in…
Per Jobs (01:01:27.054)
Thank you. Thank you so much.
Per Jobs (01:01:31.542)
Thank you very much, Jason.
Jason Elkins (01:01:43.467)
In Sweden, not Scotland, I like Scotland. I… But that’s a different conversation. Thanks, Barry, appreciate you.
Per Jobs (01:01:46.658)
You can go all the way. Yeah, all right.
Per Jobs (01:01:54.242)
Thank you, Jason. Thank you very much.
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